I voted for this collection because it was interesting and beautiful. It was dark and heavy- Fashion in the Matrix world.

I really had no problem with the collection, except that it wasn't RTW, if that was the aim of the show.

And like you said, if this were PR, then yes, it would be a standout. But its not, its The Fashion Show, and his concept is just too abstract for what the show was trying to look for in everyday design.

Like I said, I had no problem with it from a construction point of view. But this is a Bryant Park collection, not a "manufactured by the good people at Bravo" type of style.

Sorry guys, I still think that was the most depressing mess I've ever seen. I half expected the models to slash their wrists on the runway.

I didn't see a single collection on this episode that would have done better than second place on any season of Project Runway.

A lotta look, but...I love it

Leave it to such a dark and dreary collection to finally put a smile on Katarina's face.

I don't think a collection has to be "uplifting." It is interesting and beautifullky constructed. I would wear several of these peices with jeans...just like Fern said. I say well done James Paul!

This was my favorite collection too.
It is wearable, but they were correct that it has no hanger appeal which would be a problem in retail.
It reminds me of the Japanese designers of the 80's, Comme des Garcons and Yohji Yamamoto in particular, without being an outright copy though.
I also didn't get the outrage that Fern would claim the collection to be wearable. I could see her wearing some of these pieces, like the coat. I bet she has worn this type of thing before. I can see this being high end RTW. Why not?

I have no problem with dark or somber. Maybe that's because I wear so much damn black and gray myself. Although, I can admit, that I often set it off with a pop of color somewhere and I think JP's collection could have used that "pop" here and there.

Construction was stunning. Shapes were stunning. To me, a lot of the pieces looked effortlessly complicated, if that makes sense (to anyone but me. lol)

He wouldn't be my winner, but I liked it very, very much.

I love this collection. Lots of separates that can be worn with many other things. I voted for him.

I FINALLY understand what he means by a "post-colonialist approach to fabrication." What a weird, fascinating drum to beat through a fashion line. Honestly, if there were a few more touches of color, I would be in love with this.

I don't see why anyone would get upset about this collection. Not my cup of tea, but not that outrageous either. I like the goofiness of the tights over the shoes. I would have liked it better though if the models took a running slide down the runway. Ah well, opportunity lost.

But like I said before, this collection looks like it would be very at home with the Eileen Fisher customer who fancies herself a bit edgier.

--GothamTomato

Did anyone else notice that at the beginning of the show they showed Daniella's, Anna's and Reco's evening gowns, but with JP they showed his dark asymmetrical two pc from early in the season?

look #1 - sloppy/ slouchy. Top basic, skirt odd and unflattering

#2 at first thought the top had potential (I like wrap tops) but from the side it too looked sloppy
- but now that I can see it I hate the sleeve in the pic. Skirt just stupid - that side piece

#3 I wrote before silky/shiny "pedal pushers?" with a belt through the crotch - what's not to love?
And the top, just awful. I guess she looks like she does live on the streets - but Doesn't everyone think of shiny pedal pushers when they think "indigenous (sp) people" ?

#4 other than the too long sleeves the top isn't bad. skrt meh

#5 For the cocktail and roadkill reception?

#6 I didn't even remember this one- but pic is dark enough I can't see detail enough to comment on

#7 When that "skirt" piece was down in front, it gave an impression of his "bustle", and looked like somewhere to hold the seeds while she worked the land
While I liked the "jacket?" fabric, I had to laugh that even the dressers had no clue wth he was doing. Reco's face was priceless when JP was showing the scarf/over-skirt.

#8 Just NO. Hiding behind conceptual, this still was a mess.

#9 This was the only one that I kind of liked - although I do think the belts did most of the work

#10 the dress- NO!! The jacket/coat had potential but again looks "off" wide weird asymmetry.

(Which one opened at the skirt - was it #6? I thought that one was kind of innovative, but once opened, again like flapping fabric)

I think the references to the 80's Japanese avant-garde are apt points of comparison, but if you really think about what Yohji Yamamoto and Rei Kawakubo did, their works were rooted in traditional construction techniques (most notably conventional tailoring for Yohji) that were taken to their utmost conceptual limits. Looking at James-Paul's work he owe much more to the aesthetics of Vivienne Westwood (obviously) and Rick Owens; people who used their conceptual frame of reference to break down and blur the conventions of ready-to-wear, sportswear, and even couture.

If anything, this was by far the most cohesive collection of the bunch, but who knows what criteria people are using to judge these collections.

Aesthetically I think it's interesting if not a little too far on the dour side of the line, but the whole "indigenous people" theme really gets my goat. James Paul shows a certain polished ignorance that I just can't seem to get over. I, for example, am an "indigenous" person of New York. It's a small complaint, and everyone knows what he meant, but I wish he could just be a bit more informed and articulate. Enunciate my dear! I also thought it was a bit silly how he thought these "indigenous" people would like to wear western clothes, but only odd modified versions that made them look as much like the tribal shamans of yore as possible. A bit counter productive. Don't ya think?

I agree that this collection pretty much owes everything to designers like Yohji Yamamoto and Commes des Garçons, but I don't really see how he's made them his own. Slap either name on this collection and no one would notice. I like James-Paul well enough, and he is certainly talented...I just don't think he is nearly as original as he believes. He's too in love with his own thoughts to truly see his output for what it is.

Thanks, TLo, I was kind of afraid to post that I liked this.

I think what offended some of your minions was his presumption to claim inspiration from 'indigenous people wearing Western clothes.' To me, almost anything is better than saying "Hollywood glamor" or "80s TV nighttime soap". If we could pull our politically correct heads out of our collective read ends we could see some very interesting stuff here. I loved his textures and a lot of his ideas. Would I wear it? Yeah, adapted for me.

And that's the problem. They chose a conceptual guy for a RTW reality competition. I'd rather see PR's attempt at finding the next great American designer.

TY, TLo. I loved it as well. There are times (like now, unemployed and finding a job in a bad economy) that I would LOVE to be in his clothes. I want to be in a cocoon right now. Thank you also for mentioning one of my favorite designers, Yamamoto.

--Frances

ooops - "collective reaR ends"

but you knew that.

Blogthropologist said...

Aesthetically I think it's interesting if not a little too far on the dour side of the line, but the whole "indigenous people" theme really gets my goat. James Paul shows a certain polished ignorance that I just can't seem to get over. I, for example, am an "indigenous" person of New York.

Correct. As a person, you are indigenous to New York. That does not mean that your family is an "indigenous people" native to New York unless you are ethnically Native American. Describing something as "indigenous" is akin to saying "it came from here." Talking about an actual group of indigenous people carries a different, more specific meaning regarding origination and historical existence. They are not the same just because the word is the same.

I loved this collection! I would have loved to see some chroma; after all, it is the season of color (or so they say).
When I want to see plain-old "everyday wearable fashion", I head to a department store/Target.

Tights OVER the shoes...dammit, I was hoping to find out whose shoes those were because I loved the look of them. Just goes to show how much detail you couldn't see on the TV.

And yeah, I'm with you, TLo. This was the collection I respected the most, though some dark, rich earth tones would have made it gorgeous. And I could see Fern wearing pieces from it. I could even see myself wearing pieces, though not an entire look which is probably going to be his undoing with the judges and the voting public. I don't think JP has It the way Christian Siriano does (talent plus self-pimping skills), but he'll probably do OK in the industry.

If you want your clothes to say, "I decry the destruction of indigenous cultures at the hands of Western oppression," then James-Paul is really your go to guy. If you want anything else, then, not so much.

When they were lined up next to their models at the judging, I just felt so sorry for JP's model, who seemed so sad. She really looked like the poster child for some sort of your-people-wiped-out-my-people-when-your-soldiers-brought-syphilis-to-our-land campaign. I get that he's conceptual and all, but not every concept is a good one.

I loved this collection. The layering might have been too much, but there is great potential there in so many of the pieces. A look off the runway is rarely translated directly--especially when its heavier on the "sportswear" and not an evening gown.

While it may not be "pretty," its interesting and clothes that will get people talking! I really think that fashion editors could do a lot with his work.

I think he's very talented and I really loved this collections, but he needs not to take his concepts and fashion so seriously.

I was there, the collection looked amazing in person. The ONLY collection that looked like a collection.

Definitely a winner had he shown this collection on PR. I doubt very much America will vote for his collection.

I, too, think this collection is beautiful and intelligence and even wearable. I'm a "real people" and I could wear some of these things and work in academia, where this stuff would be appreciated for its formal innovation and even its blackness. Go James Paul.

Oops, "intelligent." (Gotta proofread.)

Very depressing, no colors, perfect for an "indigenous" funeral I guess.

I know a lot of artsy people who only wear black. This collection would be perfect for them. One thing I think people fail to understand when judging these collections is that not every collection has to appeal to everybody, all body types or tastes. That's why we have no many designers out there with so many different points of view. Nobody shops one designer only.

I adored this collection, and voted for JP. He's incredibly vague and inarticulate when it comes to describing his work and its inspiration, but his talent shows on the runway, which is where it counts.

And I'm disagreeing with you on the question of color. I think that the use of more color would have distracted from what he wanted to show: the form and struture of the garments.

Speaking as a woman who is only a few months younger than Fern, I have absolutely no problem whatsoever believing that she'd wear them. As you point out, she is drawn to larger, more unusual pieces (both in clothing and accessories). Frankly, I'm tired of people thinking older women can't, or shouldn't, wear edgy, funky clothing. We can and do.

I hope he wins, and if he does, and I have any money, I'll buy something from the collection (assuming Bravo doesn't trash the pieces as badly as they've done with the other winning designs!).

This was not only better than the other TFS collections, it was better than any PR winning collection.

Right on, Blogthropologist and Shemima!

"Lilithcat said...
This was not only better than the other TFS collections, it was better than any PR winning collection."

OK, now THAT's a stretch.

Great collection! I loved every piece! I hope he wins.

I do feel like I'm looking at bleak rags and being told that I'm simply not sophisticated, cultured, intellectual, refined, or appreciative enough of high art, creativity, and innovative construction if I can't see that.

Hey, I have eyes. IMO, these clothes are bleak rags. You want to spend a fortune on them, put them on, and feel superior to the common folk, be my guest. But IMO the wearer of these is delusional if she thinks they are flattering, feminine, or cultured.

Sorry guys, I think this collection is dreck.

Twenty three thumbs down.

More of the same things you see out of Japanese and other asian designers every day. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but not "before its time" like JP says.

On the Fern front, some of it is not that far a jump to embellished vests and other oversized shapeless garments.

Sorry, my first paragraph should have ended with "if I can't see that it is elegant, sophisticated "high art."

Time for coffee. Maybe then I'll be less grumpy, too.

The collection, while interesting, reminded me too much of Rei Kawakubo's collections from the early nineties. You know that JP will do well in the fashion world. There's a place for "intellectual" designers like him. But nothing in this or any other things that I've seen him design is earth shattering.

Can't a person say that they found this collection really depressing without someone assuming they don't "get it" or they're "missing the point?" What if I "get it," but still dislike? I appreciate his skill and thoughtfulness, but just don't enjoy looking at the results. It's all very sad looking to me, in an overly complicated way.

Just not for me.
I do respect the ballsiness of the tights-over-shoes thing.
And yay! Xaviera! Didn't notice her on the tv though.

I wasn't one of the haters. Aside from the monochromatic colors I liked the collection for its innovation.

I can totally see Fern wearing some of these pieces. At least he's not designing something that only a size-0 girl woman wear like you know who.

ASK, I'm surprised by your vehemence which may mean that I didn't express myself clearly.

I do think that a lot of the people who were writing angrily the other day were offended by his saying his inspiration was "indigenous people wearing Western clothes." People were ranting and raving about what is indigenous, what isn't, "Western" isn't the only fashion, how offensive to put bones, feathers, stripes of color on the models' faces. And I do think that some people couldn't get past his perhaps unfortunate word choice to look at the clothing.

Personally, I don't really care for being called elitist but if it makes me a person who doesn't respond in a knee-jerk way to somebody's choice of words, so be it.

And I still liked looking at his collection.

"MouseAnony said...

I do feel like I'm looking at bleak rags and being told that I'm simply not sophisticated, cultured, intellectual, refined, or appreciative enough of high art, creativity, and innovative construction if I can't see that."

"Anonymous said...

Can't a person say that they found this collection really depressing without someone assuming they don't "get it" or they're "missing the point?"

Where is all this defensiveness coming from? Who is saying that if you don't like this collection it's because you're not smart enough?

I thought this was the most impressive collection of the bunch, the one that most looked like an actual high fashion collection from a talented designer.

This doesn't mean that it's the collection that I'd be most likely to purchase items from and wear. JP's clothes look like they'd be way out of my price range! I can most easily imagine myself in something like Anna's knit dress with the vertical color blocks, because I can imagine seeing a dress like that at H&M marked down from $49 to $15.

If I was a designer, I think I'd rather be the one that makes a viewer think "I could see that in a spread in Vogue" rather than the one whose clothes inspire the thought "ooh, I'd snatch that off the clearance rack in a second."

This comment probably belongs on the Anna post, but I feel like saying it now:

I never really keep up with "whats going on in fashion" but I loved PR...

so I would watch the final fashion shows and think that's what collections were supposed to look like. VERY COHESIVE. (Think Jay, Kara Saun, even Uli, Jeffery, and Jillian) but it seems as though the collections you show here by REAL designers are far less cohesive.

I don't feel like Anna's was any less cohesive than some shown here...

*** sorry for posting and deleting, then reposting *** I posted under my other name (which I realize is also someone else's name, and I didn't want to confuse anyone)

I would wear whatever I could from this collection. I have a degree in fashion design but my life evolved into college teaching. However, I am still an artist who paints and creates strange mosaics. I voted for James Paul because his collection was so creative . . . and I figured no one else would vote for him. I'm glad to see that I'm not totally alone and some other people like this guy's designs.

Can SOME of the posters who LOVE the clothes, please give examples of which pieces you would wear (unmodified) and where you'd wear it?

When his collection came out, my first thought was--he should have been on Project Runway.

The collection is intriguing but the problem is that on this show, I'm not sure what to judge it against. He's taken the opportunity to show his style and he's caught the eyes of the fashion crowd. In the end, that may be more important to him than winning with a scaled down RTW collection.

Add a little color, even a deep color, to some of those pieces and I'd be interested in wearing them. (Afford them, no.)

Marie

I loved James Paul's collection the most too! I didn't feel like commenting before when there was so much hate for his collection. And people was accusing him of racism because he used bones and feathers?!

I would definitely buy his pieces if I had the money. What struck me the most was when the judges said that you just had to pair one of his pieces with a jean or something and looking at his collection from that point of view makes it much more accessible.

Also the instruction manual comment did make sense as JP himself admitted that the jackets were worn incorrectly and he had to redo them on the models himself just before the fashion show.

I don't think he will win because as it has been said before, I don't see his stuff having mass market appeal. But I do think he is quite talented but needing a LOT of polish and experience.

-anin

I thought his was the best collection in a Project Runway hype ("next great fashion designer") kind of way; though I loved only a few jackets and not much of the rest.

However, I thought this was a RTW, more down market & less conceptual (so to speak) competition & therefore he didn't have the best/most suitable collection of the group.

And given JP's obvious idealism & emotion about his own designs, I'd expect him to be committing suicide after a tormented depressive episode if he had to have bravo's "adaptation" of the pieces sold with his name attached.

Anonymous on 7/20/09 at 11:34 AM said.."Can't a person say that they found this collection really depressing without someone assuming they don't "get it" or they're "missing the point?"

I totally understand. I found Kenley's final collection very uplifting BUT I did not like it as it was not my cup of tea.

TampaBay

Appreciate more opportunity to discuss this collection!

I'd actually have far less problem with JP winning because he did put together a collection that is a collection in the truest sense of the word. There is a cohesiveness to his work in this show - obviously, not everyone likes it [grin] but that's the world of fashion!

I could see a number of these pieces in different colors and working very, very well - in that manner, the possible transition to mass market might be successful.

I'll be ok with either JP or Anna going for the win - anyone but Daniella whose collection was just outright fugly.

srq

In answer to the last "anonymous," I would wear any of these outfits to an art opening (my own).

I also could wear any of the outfits to teach a class at my university and I would wear many of the tops or coats (like the final coat on Korto's ex-model) with jeans out to a movie, to a party, etc. I would probably pair it with some art jewelry, though (I have a friend who creates necklaces and earrings with semi-precious materials).

Oooh, you want to know what I woudl wear? Here goes:

1. I love the skirt and I love the top but I would pair them up with plainer pieces. I would however skip the skirt because although I LOOOVE it, i don't think it would suit my body shape.

2. Love the top and would wear it like a jacket.

3. Not too crazy about the boxy shape of the top, so not for me.

4. Loove it, but again, would wear with difft pieces. I woudl prefer a short light skirt with the top and a flighty top with the skirt. Too goth for me.

5. I am not too sure of the shape, so no.

6. LOOOVE the coat. This was the convertible one, right? The model unwrapped it and it became asymmetrical. Would defly wear it. And I kinda like it that it's all in black, this one.

7,8. Kimono jackets are a definite yes.

9. Love the shape. I am from Asia nd this looks kind of like the clothes we have here but is also modern. It's like ethnic-western fusion. Love it.

10. Too big for me.


So there you go! Now you know.

-anin

"Anonymous
7/20/09 11:43 AM

Can SOME of the posters who LOVE the clothes, please give examples of which pieces you would wear (unmodified) and where you'd wear it?"

I would wear all the tops with jeans or a different skirt to anywhere really. People here in NY like to dress up for no particular reason.

For example, I would wear look #2 with jeans to the movies, party or work even (I work at an art gallery).

I think the leather dress looks like something from The Matrix.
But I can say with absolute certainty that I just don't get his asthetic, which is fine. He is def. not the kind of designer for the masses!

I would wear look number 2 or look number 8 unmodified as presented except for the hose and shoes. I would do traditional nude hose and black platform sandals or pumps.

TampaBay

Irony is:
Reacting violently to dressing models who are not a size zero and the nnproducing a collection that makes your models look like lumps of coal

Irony is:
Selling New Yorkers indigenous clothing with giant flappy pockets for carrying the harvest to market.

I feel like most of the "Fern wouldn't wear that" comments stem from the fact that she never wears anything remotely similar. Yes, of course some of those silhouettes would work on someone with Fern's body type, but that wasn't the question, now was it? Nobody said she couldn't wear it, just that she doesn't seem to. She never even wears black! All of her outfits on The Fashion Show (and from what I recall on PR) have been bright, have often been floral, and, let's face it, a little dowdy and grandma-y in terms of silhouette and style. Fern may have meant she would wear one of the coats as a dramatic event piece or something, and if so, fine, but let's face it, this isn't her day-to-day style, which is what she made it sound like by her comment. How anyone can argue that is beyond me.

Larry
7/20/09 11:38 AM

Where is all this defensiveness coming from? Who is saying that if you don't like this collection it's because you're not smart enough?


Full moon this weekend. Someone came up in here saying that people who didn't like JP's collection were Sears-shopping slobs.

The more I look at this collection, the more I love it. He's all wrong for this show, which is why I voted for Anna (though I added some votes his way, too) - her pieces will translate well. His would get slaughtered by Bravo.

anonymous 11:43's challenge:

"Can SOME of the posters who LOVE the clothes, please give examples of which pieces you would wear (unmodified) and where you'd wear it?"

I'll try this.
I work in a conservative-dressing office so with one exception it would be going out with friends or to the occasional event that requires dressing up.
#1 sweater
#2 jacket
#4 jacket
#7 the whole thing, with the collary thing off my head
#9 - and actually, this might go to work
#10 - I do love that coat.

What seems strange to me is that even though TLo loved the collection as a whole, reading through the comments most of the individual looks got negative comments. I absolutely hate all of the asymmetrical hemlines on the bottom of the skirts/dresses so maybe that's why I dislike his collection so much. I just don't like the look as a whole.

However, I think his collection is really going to have people that love it or hate it- no one will be in between. I applaud him for sticking with his style and not trying to make ready to wear clothes because that's just not who JP is.

I was wondering what made people think that the RTW collection that results from this show is going to be expensive?

Also, are they going to be the actual looks, or the hideous Bravo interpretations of the looks we've already seen? Because, if the latter, I'd be sweating about winning if I was any one of those designers! Once Bravo gets through with their collections they won't want their names on the tags!

During the show, before Betsy Johnson made her comment, I kept thinking how sad and depressing the collection looked. I'm sure part of my reaction was in part due to the editing, but I just didn't love it. I do get that JP is trying to break some fashion boundaries and express what he needs to express, and I did in fact love the look of his that won the challenge at the beginning of the season, but as to an entire collection? Not for me. That's my humble two cents worth...

Anonymous 11:43 asked Can SOME of the posters who LOVE the clothes, please give examples of which pieces you would wear (unmodified) and where you'd wear it?

Sure, here you go:

#1: work, theatre, concerts, out to dinner, gallery openings

#2: as with #1, except not to work

#3: okay, I like this, but probably not on me.

#4: the skirt is long for me, but I'd wear the jacket over jeans or trousers or a skirt pretty much anywhere fairly casual

#5: as TLo point out, it's a cocktail dress. I'd wear it at a cocktail party, out to dinner, theatre, etc.

#6: work (on a non-court day), dinner, theatre, etc.

#7: I'd wear that jacket everywhere

#8: again, that jacket would go over a host of other garments.

#9: work, dinner, theatre, etc.

#10: Oooh, honey, the opera.

You know, looking at my responses to your question, I see a lot of "work, dinner, theatre, etc.", which tells me that JP has created some very versatile garments.

Thank you, 11.07 for your reply to Blogthropologist. I would add, in response to the latter, that the idea for J-P's collection doesn't necessarily imply that "'indigenous' people would like to wear western clothes". It's not a matter of wanting or not; it's rather that the globalization of consumer culture even in non-industrialized sectors of the world means that we find Western clothes everywhere. Yet, J-P's point, I think, is that rather than simply accept these garments as is, they are adapted in a way that still reflects something of the "indigenous" people, their culture and lifestyles. This is what he used as a source of inspiration, and – despite the excessive wordiness – it works for me.

Were TFS finalists required to sew their own collections? I am curious as I felt that John Paul had horrible sewing skills throughout the series and was unable to execute and articulate thru the construction of his pieces. But in this final collection, he did pull out well constructed designs? Did he have someone else sew for him? Or was he able to construct without the extreme time constraints?

"Anonymous said...
Were TFS finalists required to sew their own collections?"

Yes.


XO
TLo

Saying "I'd wear all of it is a cop out".

So you'd wear the outfit w/ the top in 3 shades of grey and satin knickers with a belt between your legs to teach?

Or the mess of a "dress" in the last pic to a gallery opening?

And the look that the model is wearing in the pic with JP? Where does one wear that.

I guess I've seen plenty of people dressed this oorly, but still most of them were homeless or out on a day pass.

I really liked this collection and even though it's a little dour I actually thought that some of the shades he used were really beautiful. It's not RTW for sure and James-Paul should be hoping he doesn't win because I can't imagine the mess that would come out of trying to translate some of these but from a pure fashion stand point it's gorgeous.

I'm not exactly a skinny fashionista but I can see myself wearing some of these (or at least liking them from afar) even if I couldn't pull them off. I can't say the same thing about Daniela's at all.

Everyone isn't you, Anon 12:43.

And thank god for that.

anonymous 11:43's challenge:

"Can SOME of the posters who LOVE the clothes, please give examples of which pieces you would wear (unmodified) and where you'd wear it?"

I, too, LOVE(!!!) James-Paul's collection. I work in the arts and would wear any of these looks (both to the office or an event) with the possible exception of #10 and that's a personal preference. For me, in #10 there was too much fabric and too much statement for my own aesthetic. I've been a fan of BLACK for most of my adult life, so I didn't find his palette off-putting, or depressing at all. I've also been a huge fan of both REI KAWAKUBO & JUNYA WATANABE forever, so I can totally appreciate James-Paul's aesthetic.

Anne said ---
"I was wondering what made people think that the RTW collection that results from this show is going to be expensive?"

Interesting insight, Anne. I hadn't thought of how BRAVO would interpret these looks, but now I'm scared to imagine how James-Paul's collection would be renedered after their designers got a hold of his patterns!


- edinamonsoon -

Beautiful collection! Taken apart you could wear about everything fabulously.

"edinamonsoon said..."


You're BACK, darling. We missed you : )

LOVED this collection, and yes, it's not for me, not my style, but that was the only collection that kept my eyes the whole time on the TV set.

I hope he wins. America, prove us wrong!!!

I'm pretty stunned at all the raves for JP's collection.

I still think it's dreck.

And if he DOES win, I'll barf.

Which, come to think of it, would be a fitting final comment on The Fashion Show.

"MouseAnony said...

I'm pretty stunned at all the raves for JP's collection.

I still think it's dreck.

And if he DOES win, I'll barf.

Which, come to think of it, would be a fitting final comment on The Fashion Show."


Different strokes for different blokes!


I'm happy that most of TLo's readers feel that way about JP. As Anna said, he's a designer's designer or something like that.

Depressing, ugly, disjointed, not pretty at all. Who would wear that and feel pretty?

Anonymous 12:43, for your mental health, how about concentrating on something that you love, rather than something that you hate? You'd have a better experience in life overall.

Also, I don't see a belt between anyone's legs in this collection.

I think 12:43 is entitled to his/her opinion, just sayin'

I voted for this one, too. It was my favorite by far. The others bored me.

Anon 7/20/09 12:47 PM - Back atcha!


Some of you are making "art-eest" sound synonomous with homeless and institutionalized.

So to sum up the specifics - overall the jackets were a hit and most acknowledge that the skirts, pants, dresses are misses. Considering that most of the ten outfits have three or more (to what 10 conponents) even the fans don't like more than half of the pcs.

The "intellectual gymnastics" to explain how wonderful he is amusing.

Anonymous on 7/20/09 at 12:38 PM said..."Were TFS finalists required to sew their own collections? I am curious as I felt that John Paul had horrible sewing skills throughout the series and was unable to execute and articulate thru the construction of his pieces. But in this final collection, he did pull out well constructed designs? Did he have someone else sew for him? Or was he able to construct without the extreme time constraints?"

I do not think JP can handle the pressure of time constraints (like most design engineers I have worked with0. I think he was able to masterly construct/execute due to the great amount of time he had for his final collection. On the other hand...Reco who worked great under pressure and demonstrated masterly execution skills on the weekly challenges produced a poorly executed final collection. I find this interesting.

TampaBay

"edinamonsoon said..."

You're BACK, darling. We missed you : )

Thanks, Isabella! Life got a bit crazy and I just couldn't find the time (but I still remained a faithful reader). Hopefully, I'll get back to posting as often as I had in the past.

- edina -

I love how the people who hate this collection are so defensive about it, accusing others of being "elitist" while at the same time implying that anyone who likes this collection is just pretending that they do to make themselves look good. Classic narrow-mindedness.

No one expects you to love this collection, but you're making fools of yourselves by declaring that no one SHOULD love this collection.

@ TVKimmy- effortlessly complicated is the perfect description of this collection.

makes sense to me!

and i have fallen in love with the 'sit up and take notice' look on that principle.

Linda - He had one of those straps/belts wrapped between the model's legs in look 3. I thought I saw it, and I saw another post about it; so I watched that part of the show again.

It is there - it looks like it is wrapped through her legs on her right side.

I think his collection is wrong for TFS which is about RTW. And while it's interesting to look at it's nothing new and personally I wouldn't wear anything. Someone said it reminds him of 80's Japanese fashion design and yep, that's probably what it reminds me of too.

As to the indigenous people theme, I just don't get it. What's indigenous about this collection? And did he really have to use this dirt streak make up on his models?

"Anonymous said...
As to the indigenous people theme, I just don't get it. What's indigenous about this collection?"


You mean he forgot the feather bonnets, the arrows and the pigskin suede fringed skirt?

JP actually represents the biggest problem I have with the show in general. It can't decide what it wants to be. I thought they were trying to be all about finding a designer who would be marketable and JP is just not that person. But if they were trying to find someone interesting and aventgarde (sp?) then this is probably a winning collection since it is the most innovative. But either way, I think the girls' collections were better and that JP's clothing just isn't flattering or wearable.

You know what? We're not doing this again. If you like the collection, say why you liked it. If you hate the collection, ditto. But we're not playing host to a lot of immature postings where people scream "elitist" or "narrow-minded" at each other. It's tiresome, it's juvenile, and it's pointless. Posts like that will be deleted.

" Ally said...

JP actually represents the biggest problem I have with the show in general. It can't decide what it wants to be. "


My problem too. That was never clear, the judges kept changing their criteria every episode. I have a feeling that they chose JP just because they wanted something different representing the final three.

I'm sorry. I can understand that what he does is interesting, but he tends to operate solely in this colorless world of slightly messy looking clothes with weird origami like pouches hanging off the sides.

Plus, considering that The Fashion Show seems to focus more on the practical and wearable side of fashion as opposed to the conceptual and avant-garde, this collection seems to miss the mark.

I have to agree with TLo. This is a great collection, and it shows that he's not afraid to innovate. The jackets were gorgeous and a lot of the tops were fantastic. I feel like I'm just repeating what TLo said, but as I read their critique I was nodding my head.

This kid has major major talent. He won't win the show, but I can see him winning the 10 grand. He definitely belongs in the fashion world.

Fasten your seat belts.....JP WILL win the Judges Choice Award...I would bet my bottom dollar if I still had a bottom dollar to bet.

TampaBay

I missed the show the first time it aired and didn't see the previous post's comments so I missed all that hoopla. Please forgive me if I repeat something that occurred there.

My first reaction to the "indigenous people wearing Western clothes" was to ask, "indigenous to what?" The face paint was a ridiculous cliche as were the bones and feathers in the hair.

However, the clothes themselves, taken on their own, were not bad. I just saw little or no real relation between James Paul's alleged theme and his collection.

The problem, as I see it, is not with JP as a fashion designer but JP as a person of intelligence. His indigenous people characterization was simply ignorant.

An artist of any caliber should devote real study to his so-called inspiration, not simply use fancy words he doesn't understand and poorly adapt - after the fact - 19th century cliches of another culture to try and sound like he gave intelligent thought to a cohesive theme for his collection. It's disingenuous and invites confusion and the type of comments I imagine were posted in the previous thread.

And this, my friends, is why I cringed at Ari Fish's claims of inspiration from Native tribes in her work. I fear we will have to endure similar pseudo-inspirations.

" RussellH88 said...
Plus, considering that The Fashion Show seems to focus more on the practical and wearable side of fashion as opposed to the conceptual and avant-garde, this collection seems to miss the mark."


So, if that is the case, why did the judges choose HIM? It isn't fair to him or whoever was eliminated before him.

I really liked this collection. I don't know how really avant garde it is. It more echoes designers who are avant garde. There's nothing really new here, besides the tights over shoes. Also the tights over shoes seems to be the only unwearable part of the collection. I think his pieces are totally wearable and that's coming from a size 12-14.

I hope he wins. He may talk major shit but he has a fairly strong idea of who he is as a designer. Not only is it annoying how the other two bitches have been propping each other up in past weeks, they don't seem to have a clear creative vision. If I had to choose between them on the collections alone, I'd say Daniella even though she can't fit a pair of pants to save her life.

" TampaBay said...

Fasten your seat belts.....JP WILL win the Judges Choice Award...I would bet my bottom dollar if I still had a bottom dollar to bet.

TampaBay"


And that would be a great thing :)

Sometimes I feel as if JPs work is like an abstract painting...

Is it pure genius or is it something a monkey painted? or a 3 year old finger painted?

I have mixed feelings on which I think his is...

I feel like his clothes are just like that scribble piece of art on the wall that everyone is praising. Is it really genius or is it a case of "the Emperor's new clothes"?

Are his clothes inventive or a bunch of weirdly shaped potato sacks used to cover up the fact he has no idea what a woman is shaped like?

DeniseWang said...

"So, if that is the case, why did the judges choose HIM? It isn't fair to him or whoever was eliminated before him."

I agree, I don't think it's fair.

I honestly believe he doesn't deserve to be in the finals and that he should have gone home instead of Merlin.

I think that he has some interesting ideas about fashion, but when it comes to his execution, I just find myself underwhelmed with it.

Anonymous said...

I really liked this collection and even though it's a little dour I actually thought that some of the shades he used were really beautiful. It's not RTW for sure and James-Paul should be hoping he doesn't win because I can't imagine the mess that would come out of trying to translate some of these but from a pure fashion stand point it's gorgeous.

Sigh. It IS RTW. It is all RTW. American Fashion = entirely RTW. RTW RTW RTW. This is the only term that will ever apply to reality TV show fashion. RTW RTW RTW. Can everybody please memorize this? Talk about wearable vs. unwearable, high-end vs. low-end, commercial vs. "arty" - all wonderful things, and all of them still RTW.

This was definitely my favorite collection. To me it was the only one that told a story, created a mood.

In really life, I agree with the judge who indicated that many of the tops/jackets would look great with jeans.

Anna's was pretty, but not focused and not very original. Daniella's looked cheap and only for stick-figures. Reco's was tacky. They are all talented, but JP stood out for me.

Hey, if Betsey Johnson likes him, that's good enough for me! :)

Was it a full moon this weekend? I hope so, as I'd like an explanation for why all the comments were just so double ugly.

It is great to finally have something to look forward to with TFS. On the one hand, JP's collection is art and he probably should win for his design aesthetic, BUT this was supposed to be a RTW show, so...... I have to say that I actually can't wait to see who wins...

The one who belongs at Barney's
The one who belongs at Charlotte Russe
or
The one who belongs at Anthropologie

Suz

Loved this collection — thought it was bold and interesting (and I wasn't a big fan of J-P's before). After watching the finale, think his and Anna's collections were in a whole different league than Daniella's and Reco's.
-- CAAF

In *real* life is what I meant in my post above.

JP is one of those designers who is experimenting and pushing the boundaries of fashion. Right now he may not be "hitting it out of the park" with every garment he creates, but with more experience, self-editing, and collaboration I think he will put out some amazing collections in the future. Actually, his collection seems perfect for a film set in the not-too-distant future.

He's refreshing because the other designers seem only focused on SEXY or PRETTY.

I hated this entire collection, right down to the last seam. OK...maybe I'm not fashion forward and I don't appreciate funereal and depressing. So sue me.
All I know is that the collection left me feeling sad.

I found this collection beautiful and evocative. Evocative of what, hard to say, but I do think the feel of the clothes fits with his stated inspiration of the intersection between two cultures. I would have preferred it without the bones/feathers/streaks, though - minimal styling would have been more striking, less obvious, and less susceptible to charges of racism or ethnocentrism.

I see these clothes as going over well with academics and artists. I think they're wearable and chic at least within those circles. I can see myself in most of the dresses (especially the short black dresses and #9, with the straps) and some of the coats.

Anonymous said...
Can SOME of the posters who LOVE the clothes, please give examples of which pieces you would wear (unmodified) and where you'd wear it?


Well, I think they would all be appropriate to wear if you had a private audience with the Pope *kidding*.


I don't know that you need a specific occasion to wear any of them except the floor length garments which (as shown) would require a formal occasion.
But I would wear any of the street length skirts or dresses out to eat, to work ,to see a band, or a movie. They really aren't that outlandish. IMO.

I guess I haven't been reading the comments as much because I didn't really notice the hate. I absolutely agree that if this were project runway he should win but I think TFS focuses more on ready to wear and Anna's collection is more fitting. Even though I hated most of what JP did during the competition this collection is amazing. I think his problem was he couldn't execute pieces like this in the time frame given, but with a week for each garment no problem.

The collection was "interesting" however, there is no way I could wear any of it as a 5'2 woman without looking ridiculous. Plus, given the shape of most of pieces, I would look like I was swallowed up by a bolt of fabric. Sorry TLo, normally I agree with you but this time I'm just not buying it.

Well, I think they would all be appropriate to wear if you had a private audience with the Pope *kidding*.

Ok even though I disagree with your opinions about JP's collection and have on others - including the clothes to see the Pope... that made me laugh.

And although you were joking, I actually would have preferred some of the jackets to the nun wear.
:o)

Sorry to double post but I noticed someone asking which pieces you would wear and I thought I would respond:

The second top with a dark wash jean or a tight pencil skirt

The gray jacket could be worn with almost anything: a dress, pants, skirt and a simple top underneath

The "gauzy" dress with the belts going across I would wear as is out without the tights and a simple heel.

Those were unmodified examples, the elaborate quilted jackets could be changed and made into very cute ready to wear.

Any one of the elaborate quilted jackets could be worn over a white or brightly colored T-shirt dress and look amazing.

TampaBay

I have to totally agree, poodles.

When my husband and I were watching this episode, we agreed that Anna's collection was the most conventionally pretty and wearable. But I definitely thought that James-Paul's was the strongest in terms of point of view, originality and technique. The great avant-garde Japanese designers sprung immediately to mind.

Speaking of fashion-themed reality shows, I can totally see "Stylista" winner Johanna (now intern/blogger for Elle) wearing some of these pieces. She loves the structured, black garments.

I freaking love this collection. It's a damn shame that he's on TFS instead of PR because, as you guys said, he'd be almost certain to win that. It's a brilliant, cohesive collection. I voted for it.

I love that tiny little designer and would love to wear nearly anything in this collection (paired with some jeans, of course).

While these looks obviously fall outside the mainstream in most markets, "conceptual" designers like Issey Miyake, Hussein Chalayan, Viktor & Rolf, Rei Kawakubo and Gareth Pugh have made successful businesses selling clothing much more on the fringe than anything James Paul has shown in this collection.

I am happy to see design moving forward, even if I don't appreciate it in the context of my current understanding. I applaud James Paul for giving me something fresh to look at and to think about.

You know if "Which Looks Would I/ Could I Wear" were a valid criteria, then a good number of other designers could be


I acknowledge that designers like Uli and Chloe made beautiful clothes that I could never wear, even sized up to fit. Almost nothing Uli made could be worn by a woman with any breasts - no way to wear a bra with almost any of it. And other than than dress with the zippers by ALP, I not only could not wear any of it, but didn't like it.

So while Fern is also a larger woman and "COULD" were some of this stuff, that does not make it desirable, IMO.

OYE -
You know if "Which Looks Would I/ Could I Wear" were a valid criteria, then a good number of other designers could be ....

excluded because many women cannot wear a good number of the outfits we've seen.
...


would love to wear nearly anything in this collection (paired with some jeans, of course).

Are you going to pair the skirts and dresses with jeans? Or else the assumption would be that what you mean is that you like nearly all the tops/jackets?

I've noticed that other than the dress #9, that most people who love the collection really only like the tops/jackets.

ASK: Of course we cant rate a designer based on what clothes we would/could wear. I COULDN'T wear a single piece that Siriano came up with. The reason we were listing the clothes we would wear was because someone wanted to know EXACTLY what we liked. I don't understand what you mean by saying just because we *could* wear something doesn't make it desirable. Desirable to whom?

We are talking about 2 aspects of JP's clothes here: are they accessible? do they strike a strong impression? For me, it is Yes for both. I would add on and say that it creates a POSITIVE impression on me. It is negative for you. But that's okay. Clothes that look beautiful to you might look boring to me.

You add imho to every post, but your sentences are constructed to reflect an absolute truth.

'So while Fern is also a larger woman and "COULD" were some of this stuff, that does not make it desirable, IMO.'

A little size-ist, no?

Fern's ability to 'wear' these pieces hsould not be a factor on whether they are fashionable or not.

All of the skirts, except the floor length, could be worn in the winter with boots and long underwear underneath then topped off with a great sweater of any color. While I am at it, I think I'll add a great fur coat too.

TampaBay

The tights-over-shoes idea made me do a double take. I loved it.

haha, everyone is in such a kerfluffle.

Praising this collection is all well and good if you like the construction or artistry, but I for one am really confused if theby the aim of this show: is it "accessible, marketable, salable clothes" or "conceptual, high drama fashion"?

I don't care for JPs collection, because I think it's drab and dour, but if you do, that's awesome. But the consternation, for me, comes from the sloppy tailoring, not of the collections, but of TFS in general.

Shinything - my skeleton is a size 12.. add skin, muscle, and fat - of all things I could be called, Sizist is not one of them. My friends come in many sizes and all should have the opportunity to have access to lovely wearble clothes.

Was I unclear in my comment about Fern. I cannot imagine her wearing such (ok IMO) tacky sloppy looking garments, and as others have posted (tis true), these do not look like what I've seen her in. So while they might be "wearable" - I guess IMO (geez) - that would be in the same way the brussell sprouts and tripe are "edible". It won't kill me, but it most definitely would NOT make me happy.

C

I liked his collection. As much as it is very black and somber, that is something he likes to do. There are other designers that do bright and colorful, like Betsey Johnson, for example; but that obviously isn't his forte. I also think that if he attempted to do something RTW it would just come out totally horrible. This is his style, and I like it. :)

I loved this collection. And real women can definitely wear many of these pieces, even if they wouldn't copy the full look. I'm surprised people hated it that much.

I will begrudgingly admit that there are a few pieces there that are interesting.

However, my big problem with JP is his refusal to consider a woman’s body. ANY woman’s body – not just the fabled “real” woman. Until he does that, he may as well just hang his creations on the wall.

All concept, no content. And while I can appreciate that there is a time and place for that type of design, I don’t think TFS is it.

Reminds me of working with actors fresh out of grad school – in their heads, they’re acting the shit out of their scene! In reality, they look constipated. It takes a while to get them to crawl back out of their skulls and join everyone else on stage. You can be as artsy-fartsy as you want inside your head, but in the real world, you have to remember that there’s a paying audience sitting there waiting to be entertained.

Plus, I have to admit that I found JP himself to be immensely unlikable – both because of his shock and horror at the prospect of clothing an actual body; and because of his egotistical intimations that people who don’t like his designs just “don’t get” his designs. Wrong.

ASK - if your point was that the clothes were sloppy and tacky why mention Fern's size at all then?

If this were PR, yes, he would totally win. However, I am on the train of thought that this show's main plot is creating fashions for REAL WOMEN. I applaud JP's daring to create such an abstract collection and for staying true to his style - boy's got a guaranteed future in fashion one way or the other. However, my chief complaints are:

A) I cannot see these looks being reproduced for everyday women without some serious watering down of the initial looks.

B) The color pallet in general depressed me.

C) He's returned to the well of architectural draping so much that I'm bored of it. I get that it's his schtick, but I'm just over it.

All in all, he's got a career in fashion for sure. I just think he missed the brief for this show. We're looking for clothes that are more ready to wear and less couture. Again, I applaud him for going there, but it just doesn't work for me on this show.

I eat this shit up

xoxoxox to JP

and to Tom & Lorenzo

I think Daniella will take the win

I voted for this one. I thought it was much more interesting and attractive than either Daniella's or Anna's. I actually think these pieces are much more wearable than much of the stuff he did in the competition. I don't mind the dark colors although it does make it very difficult in pictures to see the details and structure of the pieces.

Shiny things - geez - because as I thought was clear - was since she does NOT dress like this (yes sloppy and tacky) ans IS a bigger woman - that the more accurate comment would have been that she COULD wear these clothes.

.. or WOULD it she were drunk, ;o)
(I am holding firm in my opinion and will not be bullied into saying that these were good.

..BTW I was looking through TLO's post about Jillians finale collection and noted the line:
Retailability and wearability are just as important as a strong editorial sense.
Since this was supposed to be about fashion for the "real world" - although with the judging this was not always clear - I'd say the Retailability and wearability were MORE important on this show that on PR.

JP came on the show with an unshakeable vision - with his own fashion language. Every challenge was translated into his language. And he leaves the show with his vision intact. He was - more than any of the other designers - unchanged by any input from the judges.

Just an observation -

I admire his show - for the construction, shape, subtle color. It surprises me how passionate people's negative opinions are about JP's work . . . until I think about some of the things I hate. I hated Judy's noodles. So there you are. There really is no accounting for taste.

I went to an exhibit of Mark Rothko's paintings. I was so moved tears ran down my face. My sister in law walked into the exhibit and out again swearing under her breath. Which I bring up just to say that our response to art is deeply personal. Fashion is the most intimate art of all. No wonder we have strong opinions. And lucky for us there is so much to choose from.

Susan ID

I'm glad you guys liked this one. I think it says something that even Betsey Johnson was in love with it--someone known for CRAZY cutesy color. It's true that it wasn't uplifting, which is certainly a Betsey trademark, but that says even more, I think, when she said she liked it.

Anyway, I'm not sure if it was mentioned, but Anna got it in one when she said James-Paul is 'a designer's designer". I liked his and Daniella's collections best, even though both were somewhat narrow in their marketability, since their ten looks did indeed have a very specified vision.

Although I will say, I was stunned at the comment about Anna's disjointed collection. It's true, and I agreed she lacked direction, but Elsa Schiaparelli was the first designer to show a collection with a story, and that wasn't until the late '30s. Anna, Fern, or even Isaac should have known that and could have spoken up, but no one did--or if they did, it wasn't shown. For me, that was a perfect example of how this show is almost-but-not-quite.

I don't want to say "sure, Project Runway would have mentioned it", even though I'd like to believe that, but with two such informed judges and a teacher, I'm amazed no one produced that defense. Anna would not have been my choice for win, but I think that simple statement would have made her look differently to a good number of the viewers, and maybe even swing her a few votes.

"ASK said...

(I am holding firm in my opinion and will not be bullied into saying that these were good. "

And who is doing that, dear? Who is bullying you?

Kelly Marie said ---

"The tights-over-shoes idea made me do a double take. I loved it."

Me, too, Kelly Marie. I looooved the concept and thought, now that's truly inspired.

Of course, I'd never get away with it in "real life" (not only would I need multiple pairs of hose on hand, but a big old bottle of clear nail polish to repair the many snags & holes made from walking the city streets as well) but still love and commend JP for his daringness & innovation. I look forward to seeing more from this one designer.


- edina -

This collection was the most innovative, artistic and interesting thing in the entire season.

Where is all this defensiveness coming from? Who is saying that if you don't like this collection it's because you're not smart enough?

Full moon this weekend. Someone came up in here saying that people who didn't like JP's collection were Sears-shopping slobs.

That, and the whole gross over-analysis of the use of the words "indigenous people" seemed to be about 2-4 people that really enjoy being angry.

However -- JP HIMSELF inferred this several times, specifically using the phrase "...don't get it." Which pissed me off. And I don't generally enjoy being angry. Granted, I've disliked the little troll for several weeks now, but there you have it.

TampaBay said...

"JP WILL win the Judges Choice Award...I would bet my bottom dollar if I still had a bottom dollar to bet."


I would be shocked if you were wrong.

Lots of good education about whom JP copies. The great Laura B saw architectural components to this cohesive offering, giving JP the bum's rush in. While in his element, I do not like belts sideways under the boob; belts all over thw place; coats made to huddle the masses inside; origami-wrap short coats; asymwtrical flappy hemlines; black, black and more black; half-shirts in grey.
Neither do I like JP. He's far, far away from ready to wear and for those who would buy his apparrel as boutique wear, more power to both of you. I can already get the real thing from Donna Karan minus the gimmicks.

Michael said...
If this were PR, yes, he would totally win. However, I am on the train of thought that this show's main plot is creating fashions for REAL WOMEN. I applaud JP's daring to create such an abstract collection and for staying true to his style - boy's got a guaranteed future in fashion one way or the other. However, my chief complaints are:

A) I cannot see these looks being reproduced for everyday women without some serious watering down of the initial looks.

B) The color pallet in general depressed me.




Michael, I think they have ammended the prize to "some" of the collection will be produced for sale on Bravo.com.
From my prospective, I don't think most of his collection would be all that difficult to put into production. The first dress he did for this competition ,that was reproduced was actually captured pretty well, judging by the pictures only.
J.P's collection is all about simple shapes not fitted to the body, the colors are black and grey which could be easily found in cheaper but similar fabric, even the embossed fabric that he used for the final coat.
Several of Anna's pieces are very dependant on the print. And look at what Bravo used as a substitute on her winning dress.Yuck.

I loved this collection and voted for it. I thought the shaping and construction were beautiful, and I would wear some of these clothes if I could afford to buy them.

As the always-on-target GothamTomato said, it suits the Eileen Fisher customer who fancies herself a bit edgier. Quite a bit edgier!

JamesPaul is young and, like a lot of young people, he's in love with his own vision to excess, which is probably why there is no color in the collection. But to my mind, he's the only finalist who has a point of view abd is committed to it.

I can't wait to see what he's doing ten years from now!

I really liked his collection, and split my votes between him and Anna.

What I appreciated the most about his collection is that a lot of the elements seemed like they were designed for swapping out with other items in your wardrobe that you already own. A great pair of jeans combined with one of those jackets would be an effective way of being "dressy casual." Some of the tops can be worn with long, fitted skirts. So while I looked at Anna's collection and thought "Wow, that's splendid, I want to wear that and that and that" with JP's collection I was thinking "Wow, that looks marvelous and would go perfectly with [blank] I already own."

I'm almost hoping that he doesn't win. Can you imagine the Bravo versions?

I didn't like anything James Paul did all season. Then I saw his collection, and I was blown away. It was forward-thinking, innovative, and cohesive—easily the best collection of the four (or six, if you count the decoys). I found Anna's dull and derivative, and I didn't see the Bosch in her work at all. Daniella's was just ugly—especially the shoulder pieces. Reco had some nice bits, but as a whole, he has much to learn. I'd love to see someone invest in training Reco, as he clearly has the natural talent and skills. He just need a good mentor/teacher to take him in hand.

I don't have time right now to write much of a post, but on at least two other columns I praised JP's collection. I checked it over more than once, to see if my reactions to it changed, and they did not change in kind; I only liked it more and more. I stayed up when I was *tired* to vote for it as much as allowed (I lost count lol). This is real creativity, real imagination, real originality at work, instead of the absurdity which so often tries to pass itself off as any of those things. It is a new way of thinking about clothing, and I find all of it wearable, and some of it quite beautiful.

I like it that some have pointed out here and in previous columns, that Bravo massacred the appeal of some of the designs they decided to sell, so I think the question of whether Bravo could successfully hawk JP's designs is is irrelevant. As to color, several of his designs could be done attractively in other colors, no problem there. His garments have something very special: mystery. They have an element of mystery, and that is a very desirable thing. I could go on all day about JP's collection, but I must not lol. Win or not, JP has made a *statement* that may resonate for some time to come. Congratulations, James-Paul!
--Lina

ASK you are making no sense.

This was the strongest collection of the final three. I doubt it has a chance of winning, so I think Anna's should win. Daniella's was tired and boring.

I agree that JP does not fit into the RTW frame of this show.

It is instructive to see how well he did when he had more time to work on his designs and construction. I also think he had difficulty fitting his aesthetic into the challenges.

Most of his clothes are as wearable as Siriano's final collection for PR. And his opinions about "real" women are moot as far as I'm concerned, since they are shared by many in the fashion industry. Karl Lagerfeld, for instance, criticized Heidi Klum for being "fat." Besides, some of JP's designs could be worn by larger sized women (just as Lagerfeld's can).

I am loving reading the blogs about this show, and I love watching the creative process with the designers. . . but i've come to the conclusion that although bravo was trying to create a nock off that was better than the origonal PR, they failed.

Project Runway is Blair, and the Fashion Show is cousin Geri. . . interesting, but if she was in every episode you'd hang yourself

Darlings, I liked it.

Am I the only one who thinks that his sewing still looks crappy? Maybe its just the pictures, but...it doesn't look that great (especially the tops in the third look). However, he was smart and designed mostly boxy garments that didn't show it as badly as tailored stuff would have. ::shrug::

Really, the whole thing is...fine. But it didn't interest me at all other than the 7th look (agree with the "weirdly beautiful" comment). I think he uses texture nicely, and they might look better under different lighting, but as is, its a lot of awkwardly sewn meh.

I could see the Olsen twins wearing these clothes.

For me, best effort of the three.

As many have said, actually a cohesive collection. Maybe, last hope for bravo with TFS is to run with JP and hope he actually gets fashion industry traction.

Ellen M on 7/20/09 on 6:03 PM said..."Karl Lagerfeld, for instance, criticized Heidi Klum for being "fat."

@Ellen M-I thought it was John Casablancas that criticized Heidi Klum for being "fat." I think he called her a 'fat german sausage".

TampaBay

I had to read it twice, but YES, "ASK" DID MAKE SENSE. You just didn't like what Ask said. I agree with Ask. JP is absoultely not my choice, no matter what.

I loved this collection at first sight. I don't think it has much in the way of commercial potential, but I found it stunning, especially in motion. Agree with pp's that JP belonged on PR and not TFS.

Thanks TLo! I understand his collection better after having read your post.

JP has interesting concepts, but somehow they just don't quite translate for me.

To some extent, I get the shape of some of his garments. They remind me of Woofy Bubbles' Woo Wear, which is rather Asian in (original) influence, but took on many different accents along the way.

I guess it all comes down to different strokes for different folks. JP's just not for me.

I adore bold color, so I'd have to mix the collection up a bit, but even my suburban Maryland mom life could use some of these pieces.

When watching it on the runway, it really did feel bleak. I think the music had a lot to do with it (Likewise, Daniella's horrid "music" cheapened her show), when paired with the colors. But it was just so lovely.

I want to like this collection, but, to me, it wasn't all that original. To me, it all just looked like sad--and failed--attempts at draping fabric.
It wasn't edgy enough to be anything but droopy, dreary and dowdy for me.
Meh, meh, meh.

I really want to see someone super awesome and fashionable take one of those jackets and pair it with super-skinny jeans and crazy high heels.

I don't think that it's sad, just more intellectual than the usual. What WILL be sad is, that if he wins, we get to see the watered down Bravo interpretaion ... I do not want to even think about that!

I voted for him. He is interesting. BTW, I saw him in NY and while I knew he was a pocket guy I didn't realize just how tiny he is.

Gotham Tomato wrote:
"But like I said before, this collection looks like it would be very at home with the Eileen Fisher customer who fancies herself a bit edgier."

Ouch....nailed it. I didn't hate this collection. But I wasn't wowed by it either. I've seen it before. But it was pleasing to the eye, except for the dreary colors. What do you say to a little olive, JP? Maybe a plum? Seems to me, indigenous people usually rock a brighter wardrobe.

Look I don't want to get on TLO's list, but my friends and I were talking and comments like this are confusing and somewhat pretentious.
I don't think that it's sad, just more intellectual than the usual.

I am very intelligent, but I guess I don't qualify as "intellectual".

How are clothes intellectual?



Oh and speaking of INTELLECTUAL - Heidi is on a rebroadcast of Who Wants to Be a Millionaire.... She looked pretty and fresh - but can anyone tell me if the problems came from English not being her first language - or something less, well intellectual?

(Also she called Edith Head, Edith HEED more than once.)

- Ann

I have to admit after going from hated it to kinda liked it and back again, I still find myself a bit indifferent about the collection. Honestly, I can't say I loved, but right about now I don't completely hate it. A jolt of color somewhere would have been nice, but I don't know if it would have helped me embrace this collection more.

I totally agree this would have been better served on PR and maybe part of my concern is questioning the aim of this show. That said, if part of J-P's job as a designer is to get people talking about his collection, he certainly did that in spades.

I'm with MyFawny. I like it more after a second look but I can't fully jump on the bandwagon. I think there's a lot that puts me off but mostly it's that, I don't want to have to explain that my clothes are a meditation on indigenous people and Western culture. I think I shy away from the pretentiousness of the collection, even though I am very much the academic, intellectual, arty type.

Name/URL 2:44 PM

If you check back into this thread - thanks for the list of designers. Looked them up on Style.com and I was floored. I LOVED looking at them.

SusanID

PS . . . To Ann: Does the thought of an intellectual basis for clothing design offend you? If so why?

Gotham Tomato wrote:
"But like I said before, this collection looks like it would be very at home with the Eileen Fisher customer who fancies herself a bit edgier."

Ah, I missed this earlier. Um, yeah, that's me. If I could afford Eileen Fisher.

I understand why the Eileen Fisher connection came up, but I have to say:

I'm an Eileen Fisher customer, and I'm one of the JP haters. And it's not that I'm conservative - I'm not.

EF stuff - while very basic shapes, are still body-shaped. Not body-conscious, but not squares and triangles etc. that go outside the wearer's body...or however JP always says that. It's even on some of her labels "basic shapes...something something."

To me, her stuff feels comforting and fresh and simple. JPs stuff looks oppressive.

Anon PS . . . To Ann: Does the thought of an intellectual basis for clothing design offend you? If so why?

7/21/09 2:14 AM

I will not get into a pissing match with you.

I did not say it offended me; why so defensive (yet no answer to the question).

-Ann

I'm wondering about how this was intended to play out.

We've seen judges in PR continually protect somebody they know has a strong, very different kind of talent so that they get to the finale. Santino Rice comes to mind, as does expanding the finale participants from three to four when Michael Knight came up short on the last challenge.

Here, both Johnny Poodle Head and JP were continually protected and cut second, third, etc. chances. Why did the judges do this? What was it they saw in both of them that was so strong? Considering that pieces from the final collection are to be manufactured and sold on Bravo's web site, do you think they were trying to put Johnny into the finale because managing RTW design and production is really his thing?

If Johnny had produced a minimally flattering dress that wasn't a knock-off, don't you think that JP would have been buh-bye'd?

The thing is, JP's style, whatever it is, would not appear to be able to be translated to RTW easily. And, I just don't see them having mass appeal, which I would think is pretty important for RTW.

On the other hand, perhaps that explains the very carefully worded "pieces from the winning collection will be manufactured and sold on Bravotv.com." Not once have they ever promised that the entire collection will be reproduced. I've listened quite carefully to this each time they've said it, and it's always very carefully qualified.

Thus, no matter who the audience choses as the winner, Bravo can pick through the line and find at least a few pieces that might work as RTW. They've been hedging their bets all along.

I believe (as I have stated many times) that Reco was eliminated so he would not win. I believe that Reco would have won the audience vote becuase, all things considered, he was the most likable IMHO.

TampaBay

James Paul is the designer that people may be talking about in fifty years. About how he influenced fashion.

That can not be said about the others.

Rosemarie

I agree with Tampabay that Reco was eliminated this round to avoid a personality-driven rather than quality-driven vote for the winner.

And I do think that Johnny Poodle Head was supposed to have made it into the final four. Very early on, he invited Isaac to just eliminate him, and Isaac taunted Johnny with how he might do just that. You knew right then that Johnny was protected. And later, when being given another "pass," Johnny's comment about how he only has 10% of the talent necessary (or whatever it was) was magically restated by Isaac into how the judges believed Johnny MEANT TO SAY that he was only using 10% of his talent. Isaac gave both JP and him multiple passes and, safety pins aside, Johnny also produced as many wearable garments as JP. Had Johnny not done a knock-off, he would have been standing there next to Reco in this round rather than JP.

My impression all along was that Isaac was promoting his favorites and that he expected the result in the last round and this round to have turned out differently.

Granted that JP surprised at last by turning out some garments that most of you thought were wearable. This outcome was by no means assured, given his previous output on the show. Of course neither would Johnny's have been, but as a potential finale candidate Johnny had a singular talent that JP seems to lack: Johnny appreciates what sells. He makes his living off of his judgment concerning what's hot and what will sell.

Despite Isaac's exhortion to go all out on the final collection, IMO JP's collection is glum, not glam.

Ann - If I sounded pissy, it was not intended. I have been interested in the passion both for and against JP's collection. The criticisms center around the dark palette, the shape of the clothes (not body conscious), his inspiration (indigenous people/western clothing), and his construction ideas (squares transformed into skirts, etc.).

I guess some of the passion is personal (disliking JP's personality or attitudes), and some of the passion is directed towards the clothes (color, shape). Some of the passion is in response to the conceptual nature of JP's designs.

I'm not sure I am qualified to answer the question of how clothes can be intellectual. I think the word that is generally used to describe what JP does is "conceptual." Which I think is loosely meant to describe clothing that is based not on traditional forms, but on an artistic concept. Other art forms have corollaries. In novels: Thomas Pynchon as opposed to Larry McMurtry. In music: John Cage as opposed to Aaron Copland. In "popular music:" The Talking Heads or Laurie Anderson as opposed to Patsy Cline. I may be off on some of these comparisons - like I say I am no expert - but I use these examples because I really like all of these artists.

It is worth noting that all art has a concept behind it - it is all intentional. And in the clothing design realm, there is a concept behind the most traditional designer and a concept behind the most experimental. But the conceptual artist is playing with the form itself, while the traditional artist is using the form as it has been received and creating something new within that framework.

It seems to me there has been a fair amount of antipathy towards JP on account of his design concepts I guess my question is why does conceptual design engender such passionate dislike?

I loved this collection. No, most people won't wear clothes like these, but they are modern and certainly the most original of all the designers. The quilted? coat amazing, and the use of fabric like that is definitely high end.

OK, the Bravo dweeb that came up with the tag line, "Real Fashion for Real People" (or somesuch) really earned his / her pay. The line didn't resonate that much with me, probably because I was usually getting a glass of Kool-Aid when it came on. So no Virginia, The Fashion Show is not about real fashion for real people, and Project Runway is not about the next great American designer and America's Next Top Model is not about being on the cover of Vogue.
------

I think there is genuine dislike or indifference to JP's collection but at the same time I think some of the passionate opposition to his collection and him as a person dates back to his "designing for Satan" comment. That's OK, it was very offensive and it should take a long while for him to live it down. But I think that there was considerable extrapolation from that comment and the one about his model's hump (which I thought was more of an observation than anything) to a characterization that James Paul hated women and women's bodies, could only deal with stick skinny models with non-existent lovely lady lumps, blah, blah, blah. Well guess what, James Paul listened for his inner muse and came up with a collection that achieved few designer collections have: clothes that fashion forward and friendly to "real" women's bodies. Go figure.

SusanID asks why do people not like JP's conceptual design? 3:09 PM

Because he made it into the finals with a droopy grey dress with "Goofy ear" shoulder flaps and a diaper butt, that's why.

yikes bikes! That's absolutely not true. Although my exact example may have been a bit vague and over simplified, let me try to rectify. What bothers me (and in no political sense) is that he said they collection wa for "indigenous" people, but he was seemed to be primarily referring to south east asian people (maybe I'm wrong but that's not the point) Because there are many types of indigenous people across the globe I would have liked for him to have specified and tailored the looks to a specific culture. It would have purified the collection and made it more understandable to me. Basically I'm referring to the same problems I have with his "rubiks cube" and "stealth fighter" looks. They are boldly titled but lacking in substance. To me this collection was a relatively cool example of bag lady chic. Nothing had a real indigenous vibe except the styling. And forget about these being practical! Have you ever been in an indigenous climate? They'd melt!

I still don't feel like I've explained myself properly hmmm... how to go about this. I what bothers me is that the idea for the collection makes about as much sense as saying "indigenous climate" What is that? What does that even mean? exactly. There's no such thing as indigenous climate because there are a multitude of indigenous peoples all from a wide range of climates, and as such their culture and clothing differ greatly. Thus to make a collection or "indigenous people" makes no sense. Is this for mayans? Babylonians? Northern Barbarians? Himalayans? A tribe of Pigmies? Each has their own unique manner of dress and styling and unique practical needs for their clothing. Surely and Inuit and a Bushman would not be wearing the same designs although they are both indigenous people. I think that's closer to the message I initially attempted to convey. Hopefully this gets read, but if not...It's off my chest.

P.S. I think the clothes are fine. I just can't stand James-Paul's nonsense. Can you dig it?

I liked JP's collection, although I would have loved a little color -- it's really hard to see detail in black garments. I also think we should take up a collection to buy JP a ticket to Belgium, where his kind of clothing is really appreciated.

This wasn't a collection FOR indigenous people, nor was it a collection that references a specific indigenous people. It was a collection built around the concept that indigenous people, when faced with "western" clothing styles, tend to re-work the clothing to fit their culture and their climate. I realize that JP isn't too articulate, but it really isn't THAT hard to figure out.

MouseAnony: Because he made it into the finals with a droopy grey dress with "Goofy ear" shoulder flaps and a diaper butt, that's why.

This made me laugh! Point taken.

I just have to say, though, that I don't complete love any of these collections. And I don't think I am alone in that. So whoever wins will have walked something down the runway that is merely meh or worse.

I loved JP's collection because it was actually innovative for a reality show. But, but, but....Some of Anna's pieces were beautiful and full of color. Danielle's? I just looked very 80's to me.

I agree a streak of color would have been nice & "indigenous" is vague to the point of being offensive.

And yet, I think he should win.

I feel the pictures don't do justice to what was so magnificent about the collection: The way the clothing moved, its subtle yet pervasive air.

Especially after watching the previous models, I felt JP allowed the female body a moment of dignity.

While others' items were ultra-(what we consider) feminine and flirty, I felt JP captured a grace and stateliness that is actually what I look for in clothing.

And while he said awful things in the episode of (horror) "normal women," in the end his designs seem the most versatile for the most normal among us.

I read all your comments, I squint at the pictures of JP's designs, and I still don't see it.

To me, it's still dreck.

And it doesn't matter what JP may or may not think about women. What matters is whether enough of them will buy this stuff to keep him going.

I loved his collection. I thought it was the most creative of all the collections. I think more color would have diverted attention from the design. I hope he wins, I hope he succeeds in establishing his line.

What I loathe about TFS is the constant harping on sale-ability, from the contrived one liners and the mostly worthless mini-challenges.

I like fashion but I don't buy overpriced designer labels. I buy clothes very rarely and try to stay in the recycled world of thrift stores.

James Paul presented an beautiful collection with a strong point of view- it doesn't matter if I would buy it or not. He is an artist. For that, he should win.

I'm actually a little confused on the question of sale-ability. No one buys things straight off the runways anyhow, do they? Usually the items present an inspiration, and the clothing is heavily edited before it hits the racks.
I felt like the judges used that as an extra criticism of items they didn't like, but let it pass on those they did. I mean, is anyone going to wear what looks like a leather chest of armor or exterior plastic shoulder pads?
I think the point is to present a look that is inspired, and hence capable of inspiring. In short, a vision. James Paul was the only one to present a vision.
No one could fit it into any of this clothing anyhow---a topic worthy of another post.

Also--I noticed Daniella was the only designer to use exclusively white models. Just interesting. In addition to not thinking outside of a certain size, I sort of suspect she is only designing for a specific sect.

Someone commented on J.P. during the "real women" episode. I agree he was offensive and bigoted and pretty much made me wonder who he wants to designs for, but at the point he said "working with the devil" I actually thought he was just referring to an American aesthetic generally. It was hard to tell, because the interview was so heavily edited, but I think Bravo made the comments out to be worse than they actually were.

Which were still pretty bad--but not satanic.

Blogthropologist: "I also thought it was a bit silly how he thought these 'indigenous' people would like to wear western clothes, but only odd modified versions that made them look as much like the tribal shamans of yore as possible."

Kudos! What is with the face paint? My guess is that if these indigenous (to where?) people showed up in New York for a fashion show, they'd realize no one else was wearing it & take it off! ... Unless, of course, they were being stereotyped by a western designer.

Amazing that we can still simplify and exoticize "the other" so easily.

The utter irony, in this case, is we've actually no idea who "the other" actually is. Just people who are not immigrants. And, uh, wear face paint.

I gotta admit:

the more that I look at it, the more I like it.

In fact, if the judges go with this collection for the win, I'll applaud it.

The show should be titled The Fashion Show in the Mall. JP's talent is totally wasted. He is an artist that uses fashion to make a statement about an idea/abstraction.
Majority of women buy their clothes in the mall. RTWs are reinterpretations of whats going on in the runways of Paris, NYC, Milan.
The show need to identify what place they belong to. The malls, or the fashion capitals of the world?
Based on what collection won, it is the former.

your time was wasted here James-Paul

I voted for james paul, and it wasnt about the lack of color for me.... color is nice in most other collections but if you think about the message he said he was giving, it's "native people in western clothing" which can be to some extent not quite uplifting, think about the change in culture, maybe even the stripping away of way and the grayscale of the collection becomes part of the beauty and not of the downfall. His collection was by far the most cohesive without being redundant and the most innovative, and the most well made, the most wearable on a daily basis, no, but alot of designers aren't. His vision was one to be reckoned with.

Beautiful and masterful collection! Just stunning!

James Paul should have been on PR instead. Most of the stuff he did during the season wasn't great but he really pulled it off in the finale