This whole thing was so sad. Poor Joan, and wonderful Christina Hendricks acting. I agree with respect to Jon Hamm, too -- he looks 10 years younger and very different with Anna.

On the other hand, though she's beautiful, I still am not that into JaJo. I think whenever she's in a scene with the kids she looks totally, utterly uncomfortable with them. Maybe that is supposed to be the character -- brittle and unwilling to trade being the object of worship ("My daughter's a princess!" her father told Don) for being the worshipper. Either she doesn't like the children, or Ms. Jones can't act like she does. We will see. And yes, she is every bit as big a monster as Don.

Joan is breaking my heart, but I still miss Rachel. Why did they flash that "Mencken's" bag a few episodes back if Rachel's not reappearing sometime soon?

Also, I think the chemistry (or understanding, anyway) between Pete and Peggy is undeniable, but I still think a relationship for them in the end seems too obvious for "Mad Men." I always wonder if that bizarre, clandestine connection between Don and Peggy will culminate with something truly bizarre -- or now, more importantly, how Peggy's newfound confrontational power-maneuvering will reveal itself next. Sexually, methinks? Next week's episode better blow me away.

John Hamm was amazing, amazing in this episode.

It's true that Peggy and Pete are more comfortable with each other than they ever look with anyone else. As far as she's concerned, he's married now. As far as he's concerned, she will never be in his circle. And the sex is behind them. So there's no facade for either to keep up.

Joan is killing me. I want her to stand up. I want her to get rid of the doctor, march into Harry's office and tell him she wants back into television, then tell Roger he's making a fool of himself. But can she? It's 1962 and she's invested 9 years in SC and the search for a husband.

I took the last scene as a baptism and rebirth. Don has to go back! I'm too invested in the SC characters to leave them behind and too invested in Don to move forward without him.

I'm not sure Duck ends up as Don's boss. "Never trust the British," Cooper says. The new owners would screw Duck in a heartbeat if they thought Don was the franchise. We shall see.

This was a great episode! We learned so much about Don and the story finally progressed in other areas. Joan's engagement is heart-breaking -- you could see her fiance catching that there had been something between her and Roger. I also hate to see Peggy becoming one of the guys, drinking and smoking (notice that she knew which secretary had cigarettes in her desk drawer).

In the late 70's, I rose in the ranks from an office girl to middle management, and promptly found myself in no-man's land (pun intended). The "girls" never trusted me again because I had gone over to the other side, and the front office "men" never fully accepted me because they remembered me as one of the "girls". I hope Peggy fairs better.

TLo, love your weekly analysis of MadMen. Would also love to be in a book discussion group with you!

God, I love Sunday nights.

The rape scene was horrifying, LOVE when Peggy sez she is sleeping with Don and it is working out well, the sister is fabulous (I cheered when she won't take off her shoes and at her remark about children).

Don's relationship with the former Mrs. Draper (whatever her name is I can't remember) is very . . . real. He seems so comfortable with her it's a pity he doesn't have faith that Betty would have been able to handle the truth. The first season (two years ago) would have been the perfect time for him to confess to her. She still seemed to love him then. Of course, I'm not a Betty fan and think maybe he is correct in not telling her the truth; it is probably too late, no matter what. I am a bit evil, but I am looking forward to seeing what happens to Betty when the money starts to run out. I hope she rises to the occasion, but I'm sure the writers will give us a nice surprise.

And I thought maybe they were showing Betty having her period to show she is NOT pregnant because she is going to sleep with someone AND get pregnant while Don is gone. Nice little conundrum maybe?

Donna in Seattle

Yeah, the 'Mommy you're bleeding thing' has to be pregnancy. At least they didn't have her faint like they do in soap operas.

Side note: my mom had a fur stole just like the one Alice Cooper is wearing. Roger saying he didn't know which eyes to look at when he talked to her was awesome.

Those scenes with Dick Whitman were fascinating! It really does tie up a lot of loose ends.

I nearly cheered out loud when Peggy got the office, even though my whole family was sleeping.

Poor Joan. Today it's him not letting her be on top. Then it's rape in her boss' office. Next thing you know, she'll be stuck with some babies and a husband who can no longer stand the thought of having sex with someone's mother. I hope she kicks him to the curb, but given the era, she would be considered an over-the-hill leftover if she did that. Sadness...

Um, boys, a heavy period means you're not pregnant. Look it up. I mean I know y'all are gay, but basic biology.

Besides, I think this show is better than that. Deb over on Basket of Kisses (great blog) has said she thinks it means that Betty is finally a woman, has finally grown. Go read the post, it's excellent.

Speaking of Pete, do you all still think we're crazy for thinking he and Peggy are going to wind up together?

Yes. Pete wants her, but what in the world would Peggy need Pete for? She's perfectly happy in her little world, and she is well aware of what a shit he is. Better than anyone at SC, that's for sure.

Poor Joan. I'm betting that some time in S3, Joan is going to be asking for Peggy's help to get away from that douchebag and learn how to play it the boy's way.

The scenes with Joan are heartbreaking. How many other Joans have there been back in 1960s. Smart women who life have beaten down

And the sad contrast between her and Peggy. The illusion that both women have wonderful fulfilling lives. I will say some of those men in the office will ahve to take Peggy a little more seriously. She was as Roger put it the only one with enough balls to ask for the office

Actually what I found striking about Young Don is how he described Betty. He seemed genuinely infatuated with her. He described her as full of life and laughing. Then contrast that with the present day reality. How sad these 2 people did not seemed equipped or knowledgeable about what is needed for a successful marriage.

what a pity Anna was not around more to advise Don. Their marriage probably would be in a much better place for it.

Something I mentioned in another blog is betty's motives for her setup between Arthur and her friend. I suspect part of her motives were to test Arthur. He seemed on the surface gentile, empathetic and decent. It almost seemed like pushing him towards Sarabeth was a way to test his sincerity.

A test he failed. This seemingly gallant guy, has no qualms nailing betty's friend despite being all doe-eyed with betty. And he is still proceeding with his wedding. This guy is no better than Don in that repsect. Worse in some ways. Small wonder Betty sounded pissed

BTW I am surpised you didn't mention the last 3 tarot cards. Wands and the Wheel of Fortune. The final card indicates uncertainty and lack of resolution

Frank

I don't see Peggy closing her office door as slamming it in Joan's face. This is the first exchange they had that wasn't confrontational. I see them being friends down the line.

The women rocked this episode:
Sick puppy that I am, I love Mean Mommy Betty. I thought I was going to have an entire episode of Betty contributing her kids' screwed up adult lives, and I was looking forward to the feast. I guess I have to be satisfied with the high drama of her locking her daughter in the closet. I couldn't get past how unbelievably gorgeous Betty looked while committing this heinous act to garner the appropriate sympathy for the eight year old. On that note...

Bravissima to Miss Sally Draper for giving her mother the business WHILE LOCKED IN THE CLOSET!. That was one of the bravest, ballsiest acts I have seen on MM, surely she is adopted.

Mrs. Don Draper the First, wow, just wow!

I was touched by Joan's conversation with Peggy when the latter was moving into her new office, especially Joan bragging about her fiance and gushing about her upcoming wedding, followed by her putting the boys in their place. It is a mystery and a marvel how CH appeared convincing when relaying her happiness about her upcoming nuptials (minus Joan's trademark smugness), while showing the audience the pathos underneath.

Little Peggy all growed up. She was awesome pitching to the Popsicle people (her wistful tone when talking about her mother and sister was particularly touching given how effed up the relationship is now), telling that worm Pete (but I wuv him) that she was sleeping with Don and non-verbally telling the boys to kiss her a** about her new office. Yet she was quite maudlin, when she was smoking and drinking while in the office alone in the dark.

Hell yeah to my girl crush Trudy!

In regards to Alice Cooper, this is how it's done, bow down b****es, bow down! [/TLO on Iman]. I (along with every other viewer) knew that we were in for a ride within five seconds of Miss Alice Cooper entering her brother's office. Her surgical strikes were all kinds of awesome.

macasism said...

Um, boys, a heavy period means you're not pregnant. Look it up. I mean I know y'all are gay, but basic biology.

Could you be more offensive? What the fuck.

Pissed gay.

I love this episode and felt for Joan. It was nice to see the other side of Don. Peggy is ruling! I love it!!

macasism said...

Um, boys, a heavy period means you're not pregnant. Look it up. I mean I know y'all are gay, but basic biology.

Right. And as we said, there's no good reason why they would take the time to show her having a heavy period. Therefore, we DON'T think she was getting her period; we think she was probably having a spotting issue.

We know y'all are probably straight, but reading comprehension.

"Joan, leave that asshole! He can't even handle you being on top during sex, for god's sake!"

No sh*t! That scene was truly depressing, and god help me I wanted her to give him a good heel to the groin to beat the crap out of him. I wonder if Joan's leaving her roses signifies the loss of romance in a big, big way. Oh Joan, it's not too late....

Our Peggy is certainly making her way in the world! The ad campaign that she closed on her own was great, especially the line about the Catholic Church selling things for ages. And it seems Roger looks kindly on her as well, since he applauded her for asking for the office that no one else had dared to. And the "I'm sleeping with Don" line was classic.

As for Dick Whitman, I hope the last scene meant rebirth into his true self, but man oh man, if Betty IS pregnant what I messed up deal THAT is going to be. Talk about telling someone you've been living a lie....

Love your re-cap boys, as always!

Anna Draper reminded me of the Russian woman taking care of Tony Soprano's mother in an early season of the Sopranos. Maybe it was the limp, or maybe it was the way Tony could talk honestly to her, but Don's relationship with Anna reminded me of it.

Betty Draper doesn't strike me as a monster, and she seems to be trying to love her children. Her honesty with her daughter was touching. I do think Betty is pregnant, I wonder if she will consider an abortion.

I love the fact that Pete and Trudy can get into a fight and there are no F-bombs, curses or other foul language. "Hell's Bells" and "donnybrook" really take me back...

We know y'all are probably straight, but reading comprehension

bwahahah.

"Spotting" is just that, spots, not a heavy period. It wouldn't soak through to the couch.

Spoken by a person with the plumbing, who is not exactly straight, if you must know.

Oh, and if you read Deb's post, I think it posits a good reason to show Betty getting her period that has nothing to do with pregnancy.

"macasism said...

"Spotting" is just that, spots, not a heavy period. It wouldn't soak through to the couch."

Who the hell said anything about soaking through to the couch? There wasn't anything like that in that scene. Just admit you misread their comments and made a baseless smear to boot. You're offensive, lady.

Dear anon,
I just disagreed with them, and I was trying to explain further why.
If it didn't soak through to the couch, how would Sally have known?

I am sorry if I offended gay people by insinuating that you may not be up on all the little details of menstruation. I probably put it badly, but that was all I was saying.

macasism said...

Dear anon,
I just disagreed with them, and I was trying to explain further why.
If it didn't soak through to the couch, how would Sally have known?

I am sorry if I offended gay people by insinuating that you may not be up on all the little details of menstruation. I probably put it badly, but that was all I was saying.

No honey, that's not all you were saying. You misread what we wrote and immediately jumped to the conclusion that we didn't know what we were talking about because we're gay. Spin it out however you want to to make yourself feel better, but you were both wrong about what we wrote and offensive about it to boot. Imagine if we had responded with "We realize you're a woman and all, but try and read our words more carefully."

To paraphrase fake Tim, our being gay didn't have fuck-all to do with anything in this post.

macasism said...

Dear anon,
I just disagreed with them, and I was trying to explain further why.
If it didn't soak through to the couch, how would Sally have known?

I am sorry if I offended gay people by insinuating that you may not be up on all the little details of menstruation. I probably put it badly, but that was all I was saying.

You sure did. And coming from a gay woman you should know better. Make your point without offending a) the owners of this site b)all gay men out there.

Again, I am sorry for offending people. I was very wrong to make it about being gay or not.

But I do think I read the post correctly and was trying to respond to it.

In my experience of the word, "spotting" means that it wouldn't be visible to anyone else. We know that Betty was bleeding because Sally said something, hence, not spotting.

In the blog post I referenced, Betty getting her period means that she's finally growing up, finally behaving like a grown woman. Just symbolism, not a plot point.

Again, please forgive my offense.

The preview text for the next episode on AMC says:

"Sterling Cooper is in play and the office scrambles without Don. Betty learns some disconcerting news."

Sure sounds like she might be pregnant to me.

macasism said...

Again, I am sorry for offending people. I was very wrong to make it about being gay or not.

But I do think I read the post correctly and was trying to respond to it.

No, you didn't read the post correctly. You assumed that we thought she was getting her period and that proved she was pregnant. That's not what we wrote at all.

As for your apology, we'd happily accept it if we thought for one second it was sincere because no sooner had you posted this apology than you went over to Basket of Kisses (which is an excellent site, by the way) to inform their readers that we don't get female characters but "Don’t point it out, tho, or if you do, don’t jokingly attibute it to their being men or gay or anything like that or they and all their readers will read you the riot act." which renders your "apology" pretty much meaningless.

If anyone thinks we misread that scene or thinks we don't understand the female characters on this show, that's fine by us. We enjoy vigorous disagreement. When people disagree not with the things we wrote but the things they thought we wrote, that's a little annoying. When they attribute their misunderstanding to our being gay, that's offensive. And when they run to another site to complain about us, that's lame as hell.

Comment drama aside, if, after Peggy finding out she's pregnant by going into labor, Betty finds out she's pregnant from bleeding, I'm going to lose some respect for the show.

Spotting isn't uncommon, but it's not normal either, and if you're bleeding enough for someone else to notice (as opposed to a little pink on the tissue), there's a good chance there are major problems.

Pregnancy doesn't make sense, but watching the scene, I thought it was a possibility. I don't know what's going on with her, but I really hope it's not that.

A Pregnant Chick

My question is, if Betty was bleeding so heavily, doesn't that indicate a miscarriage? Can someone bleed that much and still carry to term? Maybe they were showing her having her period so that, if she gets pregnant, we will know it's not Don's. She'd of course have to have an affair between now and when Don returns, which seems unlikely, but you never know.

So why did Betty set up Sarabeth to cheat on her husband (by all accounts a good guy) and then get all self-righteous about it? Anyone have any insight into that dynamic? Was it just that she got off on having the power to screw with people's lives, feeling so powerless as she does in her marriage? I'm not sure how to parse that.

Question about something TLo wrote:

"He doesn't even introduce himself as "Don" anymore and he tells those car mechanics that he's looking for work."

I thought that was a flashback. Was that supposed to be now?

I think the "Mommy, You're bleeding" was a "Peggy is a woman now." nod. Although I HAVE been wondering what big thing will pull Don back to NY in the last episode.

Anyone notice Don's suitcase in the closet when she stuffed Sally in?

Betty. Not Peggy. Although Betty bleeding for Peggy would be an interesting twist.

I suppose pregnancy is a possibility, but I personally didn't even consider that.

She started her period just after she treated her daughter less like a child and more like a young adult, and was, in a way, behaving more mature herself. It's completely possible that she didn't realize her period was going to start and wasn't prepared. That's happened to me before. It could just be a symbol, not necessarily anything to do with the overarching plot.

We'll see next week, won't we?

The incident with Joan's fiance made me incredibly angry. Then again the "You can't rape a wife" belief enrages me.

"mazeway said...

Anyone notice Don's suitcase in the closet when she stuffed Sally in?"

I didn't and I was wondering about that. I have to watch it again.

TLo,
I understand why you're mad and why you don't believe that I honestly, sincerely apologized.

You didn't read far enough over at Basket of Kisses, because, while I did whine about getting slammed over here, I also wrote this (BEFORE I READ YOUR POST ABOVE):

#45 I know, I know and I apologized all over. The thing is, they tend to be very snarky themselves and I get caught up in the attitude and forget myself. I think I’m making a joke and people don’t take it that way.

Mea culpa!

I'm genuinely sorry that twice now I've pissed you off because I think you're both fabulous. And worse because of running off at the keyboard without thinking first. I am an idiot.

I guess I'll just read your fabulous blogs in silence from now on.

Yeah, Betty. Peggy already had her baby, which is what usually happens after one goes into labor. Point is, if this is a pregnancy, it makes two out of three pregnancies on the show that are far from normal.

Laura Hopalong said...

I suppose pregnancy is a possibility, but I personally didn't even consider that.

She started her period just after she treated her daughter less like a child and more like a young adult, and was, in a way, behaving more mature herself. It's completely possible that she didn't realize her period was going to start and wasn't prepared. That's happened to me before. It could just be a symbol, not necessarily anything to do with the overarching plot.

We'll see next week, won't we?

Hopefully they don't drag it out until next season and we do find out next week. For what it's worth, we're not insisting that she must be pregnant. It may very well have been a "you're a woman now" moment for Betty but if it is, we have to say we think that's some awfully heavy-handed symbolism for this show.

Ugh. It horrified me that Joan was punished in this way for being so wholly in control of her own sexuality- and the far away look in her eyes as she realizes that she can't stop it is equally horrifying. It looked to me like a defense mechanism she's had to use before.

Pete is becoming more charming as he becomes his own man- but I want more explanation of why his mother treats him as the black sheep of the family, since it seems like he's exactly what they would have wanted to create...I need more episodes!

"hell's bells" really takes me back. My dad used to say that all the time. Pete's an insufferable snot but he gets THE BEST lines!!

I hope Joan gets out of this engagement with her dignity but I'm beting her fiance dumps her first and then what a crashing down. Oh Joan, Joan, Joan.

I'm always wrong, of course.

Dang, this is as good as last night's episode.

In case it wasn't screamingly obviously, I meant to write "I'm BETTING". oy, the typos.

So I guess I'm with those reading the bleeding as NOT pregnant (I think it would be hard to stretch that narrative back around to her being pregnant) but I am surprised to see that there aren't a lot of others that have connected the abnormal bleeding to symptom of something else: cervical cancer. Is that too dark? I think Don coming back to help her through this may be more compelling than another pregnancy.

I would also just like to say, on an incredibly shallow note, that I HATE PEGGY'S BANGS more than I hate Betty. And I hate Betty a lot. Gaa! I bet she sleeps at night with sponge rollers to get that effect, too. I used to have a million of those.

I may be over-reaching here - but given the episode's heavy Christian symbolism, could Betty's bleeding be in reference to Stigmata? Not that Betty is at all a Christ-like figure, but she *is* on the verge of the "stigma" of divorce.

Or, another symbol of renewal.

A cigar is never just a cigar on this show...

mazeway said...I think the "Mommy, You're bleeding" was a "[Betty] is a woman now." nod. October 20, 2008 5:51 PM

With all due respect to myself, I am not that deep. I hope they are not straying too far into Faulkner and Morrison territory. I don't have brain cells to do that level of analysis, especially if I am not getting a grade for it.

I absolutely love Peggy's virgin-mary-handing-out-popcicles campaign. She really has a knack for subtext in advertising. Does Don do that? If not, her kind will replace him in the long run.

Great review, as always. To me, last night's episode was more about rituals. It started with Peggy and the ritual of sharing a popsicle, Don's ritual of spending Christmas with and taking care of the real Mrs. Draper, and in Joan's case, the horrifying result of turning the act of making love into an empty ritual.

I had two miscarriages and with my only to term pregnancy I did have heavy spotting initially. It's the first thing I thought of with Betty. She'll go to the doctor and he'll prescribe bed rest or something because she's pregnant.

Or not. This show is so refreshingly unpredictable, so rich with symbolism that not only is your recap fascinating but the bloggers' theories are as well.

And I felt so terrible about Joan. That dead look in her eyes as Trophy Doctor huffed and puffed was devastating. I do think that Peggy is being set up for a fall. Now that she has everything she wants, there are going to be repercussions about the Baby and the Daddy. Next season.

Maybe the bleeding is simply to establish that at this point in time Betty is not preggers. Future events my make that point of information important.

I thought the bleeding was purely symbolism as well, as it seems odd they'd use that to hint at pregnancy. I thought it was about the little girl growing up, Betty taking responsibility (hence, growing up)~Should be interesting to see how that plays out.

If Betty got her period and it's a sign that she's a woman now, why does she need her daughter to tell her that? I'm not buying it.

I think Something's Wrong.

I'd rather think Betty is pregnant than some deep "she's a woman now" crap. They have to do something to get Don and Betty back together without a major transformation of their characters--which neither of them are up for.

Wow...I thought this one of the best written and most powerful episodes of Mad Men in its entire run. I was crying by the end, not only for Dick/Don's rebirth in the ocean, his cleansing spiritual baptism by embracing nature, but for Joan's forced loss of innocence at the hands of her 'fiancee'.

That may sound strange, but Joan's belief that she couldn't make it in a man's world without performing as a larger than life sex Goddess like Marilyn, her romantic belief that the jaded Roger would one day see her for who she really was and would love her and whisk her away to a happily ever after existence, her naivete about her fiancee's real brutal nature by focusing on his pedigree and credentials rather than using her instincts revealed her as a sweet, lost innocent soul. The scene with the date rape was almost more than I could bear to watch. It seems to me that the writers have built the case all season that Joan is in reality the emotional equivalent of a pretty girl child that takes the candy from a stranger and proceeds to his vehicle with happy abandon to look for his lost puppy, only to realize that there is no puppy. She is not hard or cynical at all.

Dick/Don's back story this week finally humanized him to the point that we now know without doubt he does have feelings, that he did love Betty with all his heart once, that he loves his children, and that he is capable of having a non-sexualized relationship with a woman that is both deep and lasting. Think of the many years he has been financially supporting and keeping in touch with this wonderful, loving Mrs. Draper and her son, all without fanfare. It takes a person of character to do that, despite what he thinks of himself right now. She saw him clearly and became a mirror of his best image, and the Tarot reading she gave him was accurate, by the way (usually the person reading the cards in the tv show or movie is spouting crap, but not in this case. It was eloquent and right on!) I came away from this episode knowing that Dick will return home, and although he may be Don in nsme, he will forever more be Dick in spirit. I think he will make things right with Pete, saving his job when it becomes evident that the Clearasil account has been lost. I do not think he will be happy about the merger and will get rid of Duck with the help of the new partners. I believe Pete might score that job.

I conjectured last week that Betty was likely going to be pregnant, and I feel pretty sure you two are right about that, TLo. I think she is spotting at the wrong time, will be concerned, go to her ob-gyn and find out she is indeed 'with child'. Worst case scenario, I wondered if, after one episode made a point of showing her staring for a long time at Jimmy's Utz potato chip commercial (after she knew Don had an affair with his wife Bobbi) whether she contacted him and had a one night fling to have a dirty secret to add to her arsenal, ready to throw at him some day if needed. She showed herself to be very manipulative this week, mean and spiteful, a true 'princess' as her Father described her. I think the smoking thing with her daughter was another allusion to the scene earlier in the season when her daughter got drunk on the left over liquor from Don and Betty's Lost Weekend~a foreshadowing of things to come.

Peggy's storyline was priceless, and she seems to be becoming more like Don every day. She completely overlooked Roger calling her 'honey' and reverted to her shy. reverential self to get what Peggy the copywriter wanted. I wondered if she might indeed be the one that Joan ultimately turns to for help and comfort? It also appears she and Pete are heading back onto a collision course, and the baby stands at the intersection. It's going to be nail-biting to see how it all unfolds next week!

Jill said: .....cervical cancer.

You beat me to it.(posting) :)

If the writers wanted to indicate/ infer pregnancy...good ol' morning sickness would have done the trick.

I think having her kick Don out of the house, and insist that he stay gone, was plenty enough of "little Betty is now a grown up".

My very first thought was that Betty is ill, perhaps terminally. Think of the chaos and pathos THAT would bring on (!)

Don's kids left to...Betty's Dad & step-mom (?)

January Jones/Betty would not necessarily be off the show.

They could spend an entire season (only 13 episodes) killing her off -- then another season of her and Don in early flashbacks.

Anyway...it's wide open, and my money is on Betty having an extreme illness, or at least surgery. imho. :)
p.s. honestly, I wouldn't miss her. I've tried very hard to find a thread of "liking" for the character and just can't.

pj said: "Think of the many years he has been financially supporting and keeping in touch with this wonderful, loving Mrs. Draper and her son, all without fanfare."

um...The original Mrs. Daper teaches piano...the boy was her student. :)

Jesus, after reading all of the comments, I am beginning to believe someone's on their period.

TLo, not that you need any defense as the whole commentary about the Betty bleeding thing is exactly as you described it in your commentary, but I am annoyed so I have to jump back in here for a minute...I have been female all of my life (looks down, checks, and then returns to writing), and I can tell you with absolute certainty: If you lose even several good size drops of blood while spotting, and you have on thin slacks in a light color and nylon underwear and are sitting on an ivory couch, you WILL cause a stain to the furniture! The clothing fabric will not absorb it but let it leak right through. Sally didn't scream 'Oh my God Mommy you are bleeding to death right here on our couch', for God's sake. I have left enough marks on office chairs and living room sofas that had to be cleaned during my long trek through womanhood to know that for a fact. Second, you can spot quite a bit in the earliest stages of pregnancy and unless you are aware that it is about to happen, stained clothing and furniture can be the frustrating result. A small blood stain would still be scary to a little girl of Sally's age. Betty didn't look overly alarmed. 'Betty is a real woman now' is probably the most ridiculous, laughable response to that scene I have ever heard...I believe I hear faint voices echoing 'Calling Dr. Freud, Dr. Sigmond Freud..'

Betty could have fibroids or be leading up to cancer. Bleeding does not happen while pregnant unless something serious is going on, ie, miscarriage or spontaneous abortion. If Betty had a bout of constipation then I might think pregnant. When she threw up in the car a few episodes ago I thought pregnancy.
I felt for Joan when she was raped. That incident probably wouldn't have been considered rape then, since it was done by her husband. I realize they're not married yet, but they are living like they are. The belief also would have been that Joan was asking for it.
I’m liking Peggy more and more. With Pete and his family’s views about adoption I wonder if she would say anything about her baby.
I loved the remark to Roger about his children. I want more Alice Cooper.

I was literally sick to my stomach watching Joan's fiancee rape her in Don's office, not least because the scene was so much more complex and subtle than is typical for such scenes (in my opinion). We saw her first trying to placate him, then struggle, then become resigned.

In contrast to Peggy, Joan's only just realizing that neither her physical attributes nor her considerable professional talents give her any real leverage in her relationships. For example, Alan Sepinwall thinks that she could have persuaded Roger to leave his wife for her, but I don't think so. Neither did he push for her to continue working with Harry. It boils down to Roger's statement to Peggy in this episode: "You women today are so aggressive. It's cute." Roger may have seemed patronizing, but he was right; Peggy was being aggressive for her time, as was Jane when she snuck into Cooper's office to see the Rothko. Joan's not aggressive at all (except, interestingly, toward Paul Kinsey). She now has everything that's supposed to make her happy, only to find she's not happy, and doesn't know what to do. My heart also broke for her while she recited her fiancee's accomplishments to Peggy, especially since she figured nowhere in that comparison. It's definitely a story arc that many of us, then and now, can sympathize with. What do you do when your accomplishments seem to leave you painted into a corner?

I just want to say that none of my comments are meant to condone the doctor fiancee's actions. I'm NOT in any way blaming Joan for his conduct.

TLo

I know you're not insisting, I was just stating how I reacted to it. I think pregnancy could be a possibility, I just hadn't considered it before. =)

The show has us talking and thinking, so it is doing what it should, right?

I thought stigmata too with the bleeding. The episode started with Peggy talking about comunion then you have D(easier than Don/Dick or whatever he is this week) baptism in the ocean.
I think something is really wrong with Betty but pregnancy never crossed my mind. Hmmmm...
Poor Joan...she seems so strong. I kept waiting for her to get up and kick his ass.
Btw, I too noticed the dramatic difference in D's behavior with Anna. I even pointed that out to the hubs. Its like he's comfortable for once being the real D.

Was that really present day Don who stopped to talk to those guys working on the cars? I thought that was a flashback to 10 years ago, when he actually was working in the automobile business?

I have to say, I have fallen in love with Peggy now.

I've always identified with her the most, and she really showed how clever she is in this episode. Covertly using a religious symbol to push a product? Brilliant.

on a subject not related to bleeding betty...

anyone else wonder why this episode was called the mountain king - it was the reference to the song the boy was playing on the piano.

so of course i looked it up like a true mad men nerd and aparently the opera that that song's from is all about identity...

the main character runs away from his previous life and travels around the world with different identities and no one really knowing the real him. In the end he is punished by the devil for not staying true to himself and then he returns to the woman who loved him and knew the true him all along.

sound familiar to anyone?

now what that has to do with don's future i don't know. Is anne the one who "knew him all along", or is it betty, or will he be "punished by the devil" with no one to save him from himself.

or am i just reading too much into this?

pj - I am not a woman (no need to check) and yet could have written the same thing. The fact that Betty is bleeding tells us nothing about the amount or the cause, particularly because Betty was wearing her riding clothes, and those pants are tight. I know when I was 6 the baby sitter had an early visit from Aunt Flo, and she was wearing 70s-style tight white jeans. My sister (who was 7) and I were convinced she was dying.

ej - actually spotting during pregnancy can be caused by a whole host of factors, only some of them pointing to a bad outcome. I know my mother spotted during my her pregnancy with my sister, and everything turned out fine.

I doubt, though, that MM would go the cancer route - that is just too "Knots Landing" for this show. Even the pregnancy story line would be cliched. I am in the "Betty is growing up" crowd, but I was also in the "Betty throws up (albeit leaving the Stork Club) because she's appalled at Don's betrayal.

Anon 8:05 ...you're right, far too much being made over Betty's plumbing.

However, not ONE WORD ever seems misplaced/unintended by the writers -- so it's easy to carry tangents all over town. :)
________

The two things that struck me most, (other than how brilliantly themes, subtexts and characters are once again brilliantly intertwined):

1) The Rape of Joan.
(extremely disturbing, and at the time, culturally acceptable)

Because I absolutely love this character, even when she's not very kind, I want to believe she's smart enough to kick Dr. Ass-Hat to the curb.....OR in an Alfred Hitchcock way, plans to marry him and poison him before their first anniversary. I'd stand and salute her (as did the office boys in Season 1)

2)Peggy and Pete. what to do with them? I agree with an earlier post here: what the hell does she need him for?

HE confides in her, not the other way around. Though neither are what we would consider emotionally mature...Peggy's got miles on him.

Personally, I'd rather see her get an itch to play the field, as do the 'men' of her professional station. Yeah, she'd get hurt, but at least not with the SAME loser.

She and Ken Cosgrove seem to have an 'ease' together...maybe Peg's will get a new couch in her office and...er...break it in ;)

I took Betty's bleeding as a sign of her impending 'real' adulthood. All of last season it was reinforced that she was a child in an adult body. Since, this happened right after she actually told her daughter the truth about the state of her marriage it had a real 'sweetie, you're a women now' feel to it. Additionally, we saw a few other examples of her acting more adult, like her paying bills and handling the family finances, whilst sitting at Don's desk too boot.

This is what a lit degree and two gin martinis will wrought.

Thanks, cpt_doom...glad you didn't have to check on your manliness. Sometimes when a gal hasn't been 'reminded' for a bit that HER bits are intact, she needs to check...lol.

Hi cpt_ doom, (great sig name, btw)

you said: "I doubt, though, that MM would go the cancer route - that is just too "Knots Landing" for this show. Even the pregnancy story line would be cliched. "

Agreed that pregnancy has been guessed by so many people, that surely the writer's have tossed us a herring.

But considering~~~
*Roger has had not one, but two, heart attacks
*Peggy had a baby, apparently without knowing she was pregnant (buh-duh)
*The baby, presumably, was put up for the adoption just about the time (surprise!) the bio-father is being pressed by his infertile wife to adopt
*A partner (Don) in a Madison Ave. Ad firm disappears in California and ...um...pretty much nothing happens (the suspension-of-belief borders on laughable)
*Anna Draper (aka Glinda, the good witch) reads Don's Tarot leading to his walking into the ocean ...tres dramatique!

humble opinion...this show has plenty-o soap opera qualities, but honed so fine you can't see the edge.

People die...often of cancer. I don't think any current 'leads' has literally bought the farm (?) correct if wrong. ...so I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility.

cheers!

Anonymous (8:33pm) said...

"...anyone else wonder why this episode was called the mountain king - it was the reference to the song the boy was playing on the piano."

THANK YOU - I was wondering about the significance!

Auntie L

To anon@8:33 - Thanks for looking up "The Mountain King". As soon as the piano student started playing it, I thought "How am I supposed to look up a tune to find out what it means?! I can't exactly hum it to Google." As soon as they mentioned the title (and that it was the same as the ep's), I figured either TLo or one of their corps of commenters would find out the info for us. Thanks for taking such good care of your fellow MM nerds.

The expression on Joan's face completely broke my heart. She can be so tough. She can be so vulnerable. God, I love her.

Anyone want to hear about my heaviest menstrual cycle, or is that discussion pretty much over?

This show is utterly fabulous. It really hit how Dr. Rapey McBonBon is threatened by her life outside of him. Her life and her power. He couldn't get it up when she demonstrated a knowledge of sex clearly gained before she met him; he bristled when Roger indicated that he knew Joan; and he forces her to have sex with him in her work place. That was the ultimate sign of disrespect for me. Disrespect and disregard. I could totally see him thinking, "Oh, well, she'll only be here until Christmas. Who cares?"

Sterling Cooper is no longer the place of power for her. She may be the office manager and able to put on a good face ("Don called and told you to get back to work"), but she still knows that this was where she was overpowered. And while she's been disempowered, she has to watch as Peggy, the little naif who SHE took in hand and gave her the basics, is moving up and up, exchanging pleasantries but not really caring. The longing for a connection in Joan's face as she chirped about Dr. Rapist was almost as bad as when she disconnected during the rape itself. And Peggy closed the door.

Great show, no doubt about it. And tks again TLO for your review/insights. This is way too long, but here goes. Follows is the ending George Jones song:

I see Christian pilgrims so redeemed from sin
Called out of darkness a new life to begin
Were you ever in the valley when the way is dark and dim
Did you ever drink the cup of loneliness with Him
…
Oh my friends 'tis bitter sweet while here on earthly sod
To follow in the footsteps that our dear Savior trod
To suffer with the Savior and when the way is dark and dim
To think of the bitter cup of loneliness with Him

Last week, the set-up, is Don redeemed? And make no bones about it, he is. The religious symbolism is everywhere in this episode, and I think serves a counterpoint to last week’s lack of meaning, existentialism, nihilism. In existentialism, existence precedes essence; man first of all exists, encounters himself, surges up in the world – and defines himself afterwards. It surprises me a little because existentialism would not necessarily evolve into religious symbolism, but it can with a great leap of faith. Betty, I would believe it, Don, it confuses me. And this underpinning is intended; the poetry in the book that Don sent Anna, Faulkner, Peer Gynt (the piano music the kid was playing was from Peer Gynt) all contain existentialist thought.

Each of the main characters literally and repeatedly passes through a door on his or her journey to get what they want, to define themselves.

Winners:
Peggy – doors galore, drinks from the “cup of loneliness” now in her long-sought corner office, but not as fun or satisfying as her drinking from a paper cup with the two copyrighters in her old office/copy room. Great scene, a drink, cigarette, who would have thought? She’s performing a ritual, but what kind?

Draper – doors galore. For the two seasons, he’s lived with his demons, of taking another man’s name and life. As Anna Draper said, “We met so both our lives would be better.” Don, “I’ve been watching my life, it’s right there,” …”trying to get into it.” The Tarot cards, Anna: “here’s the sun….Judgement is resurrection… This is the one…She’s the soul of the world. She’s in a very important spot here. This is you…what you’re bringing to the reading. She says you’re part of the world … air, water, every living thing is connected to you.

And he has the first inkling of not being alone, he smells the ocean when looking through the window with the Tudor cross in the curtains in Anna’s living room, bright yellow sun through the window; flash to next scene, no door, but instead all of the sun, ocean, sky, the world, and Don following the footsteps of Jesus to George Jones music, to be baptized in his new life, in touch with the wind, sun, water, hands accepting his salvation, his redemption, to live his life without loneliness, to both want and have his family, his life. He’s not resolved the practical part of the conflict in day to day living between Don/Dick, but he has the emotional part.

Lot of yellow – sun in the window in Anna’s living room; faded window shades in Don’s apartment when he’s selling used cars and confronted with the fact that he’s living under someone else’s name; popsicle ad, with a happy mother supplanting Jesus offering food, comfort, at the Last Supper. See, also, Sal’s comment in the copyroom. In Kafka, yellow meant death, but here.

And where does Anna fit in? Did anyone else notice the change in her voice talking in this scene, just completely different. She struck me as wisdom, and she's dressed in a robe. And she says earlier that she is way too old to have kicked some guy out of the house. Ancient, Minerva?

Next week? Next season? Don comes off his acid trip (I know, no colors), his angst, but he’s figured his life out, it’s possible now. I think the sale will fail, Don has no contract, and that would block a sale if he doesn’t go along; and he won’t, not under Duck. Alternative, he and Cooper block with 52% (Coop’s sister not equal in ownership to Coop).

Peggy glows in her new office, with her campaigns on the wall. Bet, maybe one small picture of her family with the baby somewhere in the pic. Also, Pete and Peggy? Curious, she didn’t offer Pete a drink in the last scene in her office, dark, no real light, Peggy drinking out of her “cup of loneliness,” yet savoring the victory. I don’t remember any other scene where one character drinks and none is offered to anyone else there who is above rank of secretary. If she had offered Pete a drink, there would be no cup of loneliness in the last scene.

Unresolved, Peggy’s views on religion. She bifurcates religion, Christianity and Catholicism from ritual. In the preview for next week, the priest says he felt like he was sent to the parish to help Peggy. Will she once again go back to the church? Remember, she has that religious painting over her sofa at her apartment where the characters are praying; am I right, way back in the history of the church, Catholics prayed 3 times a day? If so, the prayer is a ritual; whether she chooses it to be more than a ritual, and re-establishes faith, we’ll see.

Betty: In the season 2 premiere, O'Hare's poetry was in the narration:
The country is gray and brown and white and trees.
Snows and skies of laughter always diminishing.
Less funny, not just darker, not just gray.
It may be the coldest day of the year. What does he think of that...I mean, what do I?
And if I do...perhaps I am myself again."

I think Betty will get her grip back; and Joan too - remember Joan in bed, saying to the Dr. that she was sorry that she didn't know what he wanted?

Joan rules.

The scene with Dick and the guys working on the car -- I think that was part flashback. They did that several times within the episode. One minute he's Dick and the next he's Dick/Don.

Joan's fiance raping her in Don's office was punishment for suspecting (rightly so) that she had an affair with Roger was horribly uncomfortable and made even worse as she tried to reconcile that new side of him with the life she desperately dreams of. It was heartbreaking and you can sort of see how she's not entirely sure of their future. Or at least, unsure of hers.

I was so happy that Peggy asked for the office and got it. The reaction on the faces of "the boys" was priceless. However, I still don't think she and Pete will end up together. She has too much self-control to put up with his bullshit now.

As for the ending, I saw that scene with Dick/Don in the water as another rebirth in the making.

Consider this... what if Peggy (after learning about Peter and Trudy's adoption plans...of sorts)convinces Pete to adopt the baby that Peggy gave birth to? Does anyone think that this is a possibility?


Pete effectively hates Trudy now. What if Peggy told him the truth and Pete, in a effort to get revenge on Trudy for having her daddy come to her aide, suddenly brings home "Baby Pete" and says "Honey, I'm home and here is a baby I adopted." Pete can be so smug -- I could see him absolutely drooling at the thought that he could hold such a deep secret and keep it as an Ace Card to throw in Trudy's face one day ("the baby Trudy thought was simply an orphan or abandoned by both parents is really her husband's child by his fling with a co-worker").

Okay...just read my post. And yes, I know...too soap-opera-ee. Reminds me of a story line from "Dallas" -- J.R. Ewing creates baby with sister-in-law; Bobby and Pam end up adopting baby -- Pam thinks it is a miracle, but Bobby knows the truth (and JR may know, too ...).

"Joan's not aggressive at all (except, interestingly, toward Paul Kinsey)."

I disagree. Joan is quite aggressive, and has been since the beginning. However, she has met her match in Dr. Asshole. She gave him power over her and he abused it.

Pete is still less than lovable, but he's growing up a lot as a character. It was nice to watch him tell his father-in-law to stay out of his family life, and in spite of his thorniness he is capable of being genuinely happy for people, like Peggy. It speaks well to Vincent Kartheiser's acting chops that we don't even mention the actor when talking about Pete - he makes the character really complete.

Anna Draper came off as a little too perfect for my taste. Like Viola in "The Inheritance". A white mammy figure.

Everyone seemed to think that Peggy has it together. Hasn't anyone stopped to consider that she is simply rising to the top the same way as Don . . . creating a facade and pretending that her problems do not exist.

I find that sad.

Count me in as another one who does not see the bleeding as a pregnancy. I saw it as Betty "becoming a woman" this episode. The check writing, the disciplining her child/taking a more active parenting role as opposed to shoving the children off with Carla. And the other week, Helen (the divorcee) told her that she was in control now. I took this whole episode and that symbolism as Betty taking that advice to heart.

Betty is finally a grown up, and not the child she has been throughout the series.

The piece played by the piano student isn't from an opera; it's actually from the poetic drama, Peer Gynt, by Ibsen. "In the Halls of the Mountain King" is played when Peer goes down under the mountains and meets up with the King of trolls/demons. So the idea of Don confronting his demons makes sense here.

At the end of Peer Gynt, Peer isn't confronted by the Devil, but the button-molder. Peer has neither been good enough to ascend to Heaven nor bad enough to descend to Hell. He's just sort of nyah--and, therefore, his soul will be melted down and used for new souls (buttons). Peer is horrified, tries to convince the button molder that he truly has been seriously BAD, but the button molder's not buying it.

Peer Gynt then runs and finally ends up in the protective embrace of Solveig who has loved and waited for him for decades. She's gone blind--as I recall--and I wander if there's something there with the Anna Draper character's lameness.

Don Draper isn't really a villain, but he's not good enough to be a hero.

The walking into the water definitely looks like a rebirth/baptism. Particularly with the Judgment card showing up.

The last card--eight of wands, which would be the outcome--is a card denoting swiftness or journey. I'd assume he'd be heading home--quickly.

All of the California stuff seems to be full of precursors to the later sixties--tarot cards, free love, drugs--and Don with his taste for Beatnik poetry and New Age cinema is reaching out for that.

I don't think the blood's a sign that Betty's a woman--it's some sort of plot point--it does look to heavy for spotting.

Don / Dick -- the scenes with the hotrods were beautiful, illuminating his own metaphorical conversion from thinking like a used-car salesman to creatively assembling from different cars a unique, high-performance machine -- and along with that, understanding packaging and desire of that new car, by way of the second hot-rodder there who we learn can design a car to "match anyone's personality"... And this really was the period of California and Hot Rodding, so it just was perfect.

The whole CA scenario was wonderful, the atmosphere was palpable, and in contrast to NYC. I loved being able to see Don interact with the original Mrs.Draper. It showed the humanity of his character that got lost in the conversion process. And as she points out, wisdom comes with experience, and thus also change is possible.

The upcoming season end episode is SO set up.

Peggy learns from Don's lesson, conversion indeed - she takes the Catholic Church and her family memories - "That female character looks familiar"... indeed!

Pete is still a jerk. Anywhere. In Peggy's office, I didn't see any warmth for a new relationship - she was excited to share the new first office with someone - and he came in - but then he was trying to inform on Don. Peggy was great for having a dignified wall - she knows what Don did for her, irregardless. But Don's dissappearance was introduced, and she's thinking about it.

January Jones... I don't know if it's the actress or her character, it feels flatter all the time. But then it is one who is repressed, and certainly screwed-tighter than helpful by her upbringing. I don't know how much leverage she has just walking around in the house, reacting to the kids, etc...

Don's coming back in what can only promise to be a hell of a wrapup.

Jeezus! John Hamm is a looker. I want to marry him. Or just stare at him.

Everyone seemed to think that Peggy has it together. Hasn't anyone stopped to consider that she is simply rising to the top the same way as Don . . . creating a facade and pretending that her problems do not exist.

I think you are right that there are a huge number of unresolved issues for Peggy, but her pursuit of her career has always been her prime motivator, even before she got pregnant. I do think they have to wrap up the pregnancy storyline (and with the good Father coming back next week, we are sure to see a lot of Peggy), particularly if the child we see at Anita's is her child or Peggy's. If Peggy's has been given up for adoption, I don't see Pete getting that child, but finding out about it at some point in the future.

The preview scene next week has Harry talking about how "Kennedy's speech" will eat into prime time TV and into his revenue for the month. I can only assume that the Cuban Missle Crisis, which was October of 1962 (we're in late September now, I think - so that Pacific water must have been COLD) will be the backdrop for the episode, which is called "Meditations on an Emergency." The near end-of-the-world would be a powerful reason for Don to come home.

omg joan.... :(

not our joan!!! i hate her fiance so much!! that vile *&^%$#!!! it killed me when she tried to say good things about him after the fact... ugh! joan!!!! i want her to want what peggy wants. it's time.

im certain that don's final scene was a baptism/rebirth/washing away of his sins moment. he's cleaning his slate. and he'll be back to set things right in new york soon enough. anna has helped to center him and i think he will return with renewed focus. the trip to LA was about seeing how far he could wander down the hobo path before he went running back to the life he's created. he's had a good look and there just isnt enough to keep his interest for very long.

pete & peggy? im still thinking they wont get together. they're friends at best and thats all itll ever be with them. at the end of the day pete still cant quite figure her out and i doubt he's got enough depth to ever understand the unconventional woman. besides peggy sees him for what he is and isnt looking to make the same mistake twice.

the preview of the priest for next week has me worried for her. things are going too good and im afraid he's gonna try to fuck it up. it'd be way to soap opera for her to get pete to adopt their baby and i hope like hell the show doesnt go there.

betty is totally pregs/miscarrying or something. im assuming next week will be 'the abortion episode', in which betty questions whether or not to carry another one of don's babies. then again, back then she wouldnt have had much of a choice.

and as far as the fate of SC, there's no chance its going to be handed over to the brits, despite what we saw. cooper doesnt want it, roger's being selfish, duck's a booze-swilling swindler and don wont have it. it can't go through. seriously, don working for mr. sheffield? not happenin'.

TLo said... that was Dick and not the wholly created Don Draper we saw throughout the entire episode)...

Perhaps this was patently obvious to others, but this blew my mind.

===

Glammy said...Don Draper isn't really a villain, but he's not good enough to be a hero.

I know you may have been using Don Draper and Dick Whitman interchangeably, but it sparked a thought...

I wonder if both Don Draper 1.0 and Don Draper 2.0 are villains. I've always wondered that about Don Draper 2.0 vs. Dick Whitman, i.e., was the life that DW had so desperately bad that any other life was better. Yeah it sucked: hardscrabble farm life, religious zealots for parents, alcoholism, beatings, the stigma of being a whore's son, but at that time his existence was defined more by the circumstances, people and environment around him, than DW himself.

Now we know (or at least have hints) that DD 1.0 wasn't exactly a prize in the character department either.

Coming from a mom here, you CAN have heavy bleeding at the beginning of a pregnancy. It's not always a miscarriage, sometimes it's just placenta issues.

Anonymous said...

So why did Betty set up Sarabeth to cheat on her husband (by all accounts a good guy) and then get all self-righteous about it? Anyone have any insight into that dynamic? Was it just that she got off on having the power to screw with people's lives, feeling so powerless as she does in her marriage? I'm not sure how to parse that.

the way i see it, misery loves company. betty is in a place she never imagined shed be in with her marriage and sarabeth had something she no longer had - security. she played sarabeth and brought her down. now she's miserable too. betty's inherently selfish and wants every one around her to suffer when shes suffering.

on some level i think betty was trying to test the boundaries of marriage without having to commit any real sins of her own. now she feels justified believing that all marriages are fragile, not just hers.

These people are so full of humanity except for Dr. McCreepy. Joan was focusing on something when she was raped or maybe just disassociating. Their secrets were so common of the time. Reminds me of the movie Far from Heaven. Anna did remind me of the Russian for the Sopranos even down to the bum leg. Thanks for all the interesting blogging.

Can I audit this blog for credit? It's like being back in a really good HS/college Lit class. I love reading the responses from all of you.

ok - tossing two cents into the pool of betty's blood stain... :P

she did have her riding clothes on and was probably riding earlier that day. we've seen her ride the horse pretty hard and the activity could have been a bit too aggressive for a pregnant woman... hence pregs & spotting or miscarrying. though if she were miscarrying, there should probably have been some cramps/pain to go along with it.

callin' it pregs! :P

ps - while i like the theory of betty 'becoming a woman', i worry there might be a conversation in the near future in which sally asks betty if shes ever had that 'not so fresh feeling'...

What Maggie said above: One *can* have sudden, heavy bleeding in the first trimester. May be a sign of impending miscarriage, may not be. I think it would be too bizarre for the writers to focus on Betty's period. I think it's pregnancy. What I'm wondering is how she will let Dick/Don know. No one knows where he is.

Bill said... Can I audit this blog for credit? It's like being back in a really good HS/college Lit class. I love reading the responses from all of you.October 21, 2008 10:13 AM

Or Human Anatomy class.

willow said:

They have to do something to get Don and Betty back together without a major transformation of their characters

I think the Cuban Missile crisis will bring Don back to Betty. The threat of war will scare the hell out of him.

"Bill said... Can I audit this blog for credit? It's like being back in a really good HS/college Lit class. I love reading the responses from all of you"


I feel the same way. I'm so glad Tlo are posting about Mad Men. I love their posts and the comments here.

When someone says 'this is going to be a long post I'm sorry' and my response is always 'no, no, please make it long' : )

It doesn't matter who's right or who's wrong, it's such a great dialogue among the fans of the show.

OK, I've read all of the comments so far. The Peer Gynt slant was pretty obvious, as was the "washed in the blood of the lamb" symbolism; but, I can never get past the falling man in the opening credits. Is that Don taking a final leap when the series ends? Is everything leading up to that final leap?

I also keep imagining these characters in 1968 or '69. Who will they "grow up" to be? I might just dig out "Same Time Next Year" and revisit the changes those two characters went through.

This is definitely one of the best TV shows ever made. Last year, I was afraid it would just go away... because I had no one else to talk to about it.

One last thing: I just read that the show has been renewed, but no actors' final contracts have been signed. That might explain the "up in the air" quality of these last few episodes of the season.

An additional thought on the "Betty has Cervical/Uterine/Endometrial Cancer" is that it would also give yet another opportunity to highlight the repression and stigma of the era. In the early '60s, Cancer was still a stigmatized disease, to the point that people would whisper the word or lie about their health so as to avoid the shame of admitting that they had "The big C." A family history of cancer was actually considered a secret to keep! If they went in the direction of Betty not only being terminally ill, but dealing with hiding a socially unacceptable ailment (The C word! In the lady parts!), it could dovetail with a lot of the other themes that are coming to a head this season.

Wow, leave the comment boards for a day and all hell breaks loose!

I have to say, one thing that really stuck with me about this episode is the Joan/Peggy dichotomy. Especially the scene when they are talking about "Dr. Ass-hat" as one of the previous posters wonderfully called him.

Peggy gives Joan a complement in a way by saying the Dr. is handsome and "a keeper". I have forgotten, but did Joan give Peggy one in return for her new office?

I ask, because I feel that Joan is playing the game that some women still do today. "Honey, you may have the corner office, but I've got the guy (and/or family), and isn't that all that matters? Poor single you!"

I think that was part of the reason Joan talked up Dr. Ass-hat. It wasn't just to cover up or not mention what had went on in Don's office, but still a way to put Peggy in her place.

But then again, Joan is still the one making arrangements to have Peggy's name put on the door.

And I didn't notice before, but Peggy is becoming more of 'one of the boys' isn't she? At least with the drinking.

I know my post isn't a mind-blowing analysis: I was never very good at Comp. Lit. courses. But, I'm going to love, love, love watching how these two characters, Joan and Peggy, play out the roles that they and society have put to them. It's a refresher on what women went through before the feminist movement, and also a reminder of what that word used to mean before it was turned into a pejoritive.

Haven't read through the comments but wanted to point out something as what can or can't happen in pregnancy. So if this has already been said, sorry.

A woman can have a threatened miscarriage - bleed but not miscarry - due to complicating factors, most commonly stress. It is not that uncommon and after rest and stress-reduction, the pregnancy goes swimmingly.

Just sayin' Betty bleeding and being pregnant is not that far out there. That much emotional repression must cause quite a bit of stress.

Did anybody pick up on the fact that Alice Cooper is one big old Lezzie. Oh yes yes yes, she is. Burt asked her straight off how her "companion" was, they were planning a trip, and Alice said, well, she's moody. Watch the scene again, and you will pick up on this. This is just so great, Alice is so evil, I love her.

Suz

I think I've discovered my newest addiction now that PR is over. Thank you, Tlo!

I haven't watched before, so I need to catch up. Before I go to Blockbuster to rent the first season, is there a site where I can view the episodes online? Without having to accept that site's software? I've only found scenes on YouTube, not full episodes. Anyone?

Alice Cooper is one big old Lezzie. Oh yes yes yes, she is. Burt asked her straight off how her "companion" was, they were planning a trip, and Alice said, well, she's moody.

You may be right but I don't think that's a given. I'm a straight woman who sometimes vacations with another straight woman. We find it easier and probably safer than travelling alone. Could be that Alice is a widow travelling with an old friend, perhaps someone that Burt doesn't like because she's always tagging along with Alice.

Granted, this show is laden with symbolic and double meanings, but sometimes a cigar IS just a cigar.

Nice interview with Bryan Batt in the Washington Post.


Anonymous 1:36: it's not at all unusual for a wealthy widow to have a paid companion. Doesn't mean she's a lesbian. It means she has enough money to pay someone to handle the little details of life she doesn't want to bother with, and, frankly, to have someone to talk at.

Glammy, thanks for the Peer Gynt lesson. I was too lazy to go searching myself and was curious.

Can you put a "Yes, yes, we now know all the possible reasons why a pregnant woman might bleed!" disclaimer at the top? I've had 3 kids and *I'm* a bit ooged at all the placentas and blood.

Agreeing with Bill--this is the hardest my brain has worked on a piece of pop culture since grad school. And it's free!

grackle girl, try fancast.com for full episodes of Mad Men before you go to blockbuster.

Thanks, delilahboyd. They don't appear to have Mad Men in their full episode list. But they have a lot of other shows, which is good to know. Bookmarked.

As far as the chances of Pete adopting Peggy's baby, wouldn't that kid be like 2 years old now? I would assume someone would have adopted him/her by now.

Try sidereel.com, and yidio.com for full-length episodes of Mad Men. (Alternately, you could try Tudou.com but it's harder to navigate since it's all in Chinese.) Best thing is that you can stream the vids on those sites and not download anything. Avoid places that force you to download anything to view episodes! They'll simply clutter and mess your hard-drive up.

Re: Coop's sister, I don't think having a companion means anything more than she has sufficient money to travel, and pays a companion to go with her, who handles the details.
We don't know where the sister lives, so she may have just come into town.
From experience in my family, they're widowed and need someone to help on stuff and companionship; they're still active, not housebound and the companions are usually in need of money and want to travel too.
I haven't seen it in years, but I am sure some still do. If it works, it's actually a good deal for everyone, inlcuding relatives.
Remember too travel back then was not what it is today or even in the 70s; jets had just started. Before, u traveled by train or ship, and that was a hassle for an elderly woman. And the person hired would be someone to have meals with, etc. I also am pretty sure you didn't see as many single or widowed women traveling alone then. I thought it was a nice touch in the episode, it gave u clues to Coop's and his sister's background.

I thougt the writers got Betty and hte times dead on accurate when she found her daughter smoking. Her concern was that "you'll burn the house down" not that "you're starting a habit that will cost you tens of thousands of dollars and major health issues throughout your life"

One does not soil one's trousers on this program without catastrophic consequences:

1) Dick in Korea, wet himself and blew up the ammo dump, killing Don Draper.

2) Freddy Rumsen wet himself and it was the catalyst for his dismissal.

3) Betty wet herself...what will happen to her?

It's a bad omen.

If Betty is preggers, the father is the late-night Esso tow-truck driver. Then when Dick returns to Ossining, he can use his new skills as a SoCal hot-rod mechanic to get a job at the Esso station, later making partner of course. A decade later, he will invent self-serve gas pumps and make a fortune.

Seriously, I loved Peggy in the Xerox room office handing 2 equal drinks to the guys. And the popsicle artwork where the mom looked like a 1950s Virgin Mary. Ya gotta love Sal, he knows his Catholic symbolism!

Regarding the comment about Alice's companion...Didn't she say something to Coop that he should go to Montana and visit his cows and then something about him and an architect? I know I heard something to that effect RIGHT after her "companion" remark.

If they were trying to get the point across that Betty might be preggers, don't you think they would somehow present a missed period, morning sickness, a belly bulge, something???

Pregnancy was the last thing that came to my mind when Sally said "Mommy, you're bleeding." To me that screams "You got your period, you're NOT pregnant.

Oh what a crazy controversy on my favorite gay website.

Is it ever explained why Don and Anna did or didn't have a romantic relationship?

Bleeding to me represents vulnerability, pain, fear. Not sure what that scene was about.

There is always the longshot that Betty was pregnant and terminated. Back then the procedure was far riskier. I would suspect she'd be in a fair amount of pain tho, if she were suffering some aftereffect. Just throwing in another possible scenario.


Orrrr.... it means nothing more than just she bled a bit, which happens sometimes, and there will be no followup.

So it was a baby!

I cannot wait for your take on the finale!! The Peggy and Pete scene was amazing.

Also, is it just me being a big John Waters fan or does anyone else think of the Drapes in Cry Baby whenever that say Draper? Maybe Don will help Betty grow up a little more by teaching her how to french kiss?! hahaha

Ok, I know I'm a FULL YEAR LATE responding to this post, but it's your fault that you hooked me into MM as much as you did, lol! I just finished season 2 today and am looking for season 3 online.

In any event, since this episode was just dripping in symbolism, I felt I needed to put in my $0.02.

~The pink door for Peggy, the blue doors for the men. I thought that SC got a paint job, but then I noticed that it was just her door that was pink. Hmmm.

~Joan's finace is a THORACIC SURGEON. As in open heart surgery. A man who manipulates hearts.

~Although it wasn't this episode, there have been two references to HAM, or HAMM. When Bobby asked Don what his father liked to eat, he said HAM. Yes, we know his father was a horn dog, but ew. When Helen's son ran away to Betty's and she fed him lunch, he told her that he didn't like HAM. That was more relevant because the kid was basically saying that he didn't like her husband, played by Jon Hamm.

Keep 'em coming, boys!!